80% Lowers

[JohnyMac]

I was swapping e-mails with GAP and one subject came up concerning building your own AR using 80% completed lowers. So I did a little research and I finally came up with this company:

http://www.colfaxtactical.com/

First I wanted to give the guys (Like me) a heads up on doing this because:
> It was relatively cheap, and
> There is no record of it in any alphabet soup database.

They are coming out with an AR 10 lower this year.

Thoughts?

[gapatriot]

I havent heard of any builds on those lowers but they look very nice! But a word of warning not all 80% are created equal. I have heard of some having fit issues. These may be very good lowers like I said i have never heard of anyone building on them. Tacical machine has great reviews on the ar-15's and ar-10's. https://www.tacticalmachining.com/80-products.html

[WhiteWolf]

Damn, I had no idea. Me likey. If you keep up with it let me know when they come out with that .308 lower.

[JohnyMac]

Great GAP. Thx for the additional contact. I just saved it. [URL=http://www.smileyvault.co

[thatGuy]

Hey Gang,

That last 20% is a real pain in the ass to finish. You will need and end mill and a drill press or a crooked machinest to finish this job. IF you got those things then send me a PM because I need some shit worked on.

[NOLA556]

i wouldn't touch that with a 10-foot pole. get caught "manufacturing" and it's worse than a normal weapon charge. of course, I'm not a lawyer so don't quote me. all I know is I used to work with a fellow who got slapped with a "manufacturing weapons" charge and he's fucked for life.

(this opinion applies to peace-time only  )

I could approve of buying one or two of these and LEAVING THEM ALONE until shit gets bad enough to justify such activities. just my .02

[gapatriot]

The machining can be done with a drill press and a drimel you dont need a mill. It is 100% legal to build your own firearms for your own use, as long as they comply with the laws IE: NFA regulations. You are only a manufacturer if you sell said firearms, hell when you build your own you dont even have to legaly have a serial number on it! Building an AR from an 80% lower is just as legal as building an AK from a flat. Technicaly as far as nfa is concerned a citizen should be able to get a class 3 stamp and build a F/A since they arent a manufacturer. But the ATF wont do that because they dont care about the laws. Anyone interested in roll your own firearms check out www.weaponsguild.com

[crudos]

Thanks for the info JM and GAP. [URL=http://www.smileyvault.co

[Reaver]

Hey Gang,

That last 20% is a real pain in the ass to finish. You will need and end mill and a drill press or a crooked machinest to finish this job. IF you got those things then send me a PM because I need some shit worked on.

Shhhh...

[NOLA556]

The machining can be done with a drill press and a drimel you dont need a mill. It is 100% legal to build your own firearms for your own use, as long as they comply with the laws IE: NFA regulations. You are only a manufacturer if you sell said firearms, hell when you build your own you dont even have to legaly have a serial number on it! Building an AR from an 80% lower is just as legal as building an AK from a flat. Technicaly as far as nfa is concerned a citizen should be able to get a class 3 stamp and build a F/A since they arent a manufacturer. But the ATF wont do that because they dont care about the laws. Anyone interested in roll your own firearms check out www.weaponsguild.com

damn, well i guess i stand corrected. in that case, have at it!  [url=http://www.freesmileys.or

I, however, am not confident enough in my craftsmanship to trust my life to a rifle that I manufactured. I'll stick with factory made stuff for now, but a paperless rifle is indeed an attractive prospect.

[JohnyMac]

I just received an e-mail from: http://www.colfaxtactical.com/ and they told me that the 308 lower would be available April 1.

[technique]

i wouldn't touch that with a 10-foot pole. get caught "manufacturing" and it's worse than a normal weapon charge. of course, I'm not a lawyer so don't quote me. all I know is I used to work with a fellow who got slapped with a "manufacturing weapons" charge and he's fucked for life.

(this opinion applies to peace-time only  )

I could approve of buying one or two of these and LEAVING THEM ALONE until shit gets bad enough to justify such activities. just my .02

Just so no one gets confused, you can actually refer to the BATFE website
and find out the legalities of Homemade Firearms.- You will find that it is perfectly legal to do so.

Places about the internets also have letters of clarification on the subject, such as these:

http://www.victorinc.com/images/ATF's%20AMD-65%20Response%20-%20Pg%201.jpg
http://www.victorinc.com/images/ATF's%20AMD-65%20Response%20-%20Pg%202.jpg

In brief,

-You may build your own firearm (read and make sure it's a legal firearm you're building)
-You are not required by Federal Law to mark or serialize said homemade firearm (local law may be different)
-You are required to mark a homemade firearm should you sell it. Mark it as a licensed Mfg'er would (27 CFR ? 478.92 )

Wait? Did you just say sell it? You can't do that!!!

Why yes, yes you can. It's all about the magical intent .
Don't go into business, unlicensed and intending to start selling guns for a living.

If you make a few for yourself, have a financial hardship and need cash- even the ATF understands and
permits you to do so... just don't go push that envelope.

Just about everyone builds their own AK's, FAL's, MP5's...etc
It's all good and legal!
 

[thatGuy]

The alphabet soup has changed some of the dimensions on firearms to prevent them from doing some things. If you milled your own lower you could make it legal for today's totalitarian state while maintaining its historic dimensions.

wink, wink, nudge, nudge.

[gapatriot]

That guy is correct! As far as i know the only thing you cant do to a lower is drill the extra hole. That would be constructive intent boys 10 years in a federal bang me in the ass prison and $400000 fine per weapon. Just so anybody that thinks it would be cool to have some un registard f/a they dont play around.

[technique]

You wouldn't have to do an 80% lower just to make a machinegun. Hell, if you had the mill required to
to make an 80% a complete working firearm, you might as well save yourself some time and mill an AR you already have.

Sure the dimensions are off on most new production lowers, but it's undersized.

It's a matter of width and depth and of course a hole.


(disclaimer and such)
Of course, as stated plenty in this thread, unless you're an FFL07/SOT2 ( I am)
you can't legally manufacture yourself a machinegun anyway. You've been punked by the NFA.

[gapatriot]

07 in a couple of months(waiting on atf) SOT in july not going to spend the money now, just to spend it again in 3 months.

[gapatriot]

But really though you dont need a mill to finish an 80% lower all you need is a drill press a dremal and a file if you really want things to look pretty. Building a weapon isnt that that big of deal or that hard. Guys in caves in the stan build ak's all day long, you should be able to build something in you garage using the web for info.

[JohnyMac]

I got a call from Colfax Tactical: http://www.colfaxtactical.com/  letting me know that their 80% AR 10 lowers are ready for delivery. $169- for the lower and $99- for the jig.

Concerning f/a I would be more inclined to make a Ligning LinK then mill out my lower for f/a. Now with that said, I agree with all that has been writen earlier in that s/a is just fine. Of course controlled 2-3 round bursts might be nice. 

[Mlee]

The machining can be done with a drill press and a drimel you dont need a mill. It is 100% legal to build your own firearms for your own use, as long as they comply with the laws IE: NFA regulations. You are only a manufacturer if you sell said firearms, hell when you build your own you dont even have to legaly have a serial number on it! Building an AR from an 80% lower is just as legal as building an AK from a flat. Technicaly as far as nfa is concerned a citizen should be able to get a class 3 stamp and build a F/A since they arent a manufacturer. But the ATF wont do that because they dont care about the laws. Anyone interested in roll your own firearms check out www.weaponsguild.com

damn, well i guess i stand corrected. in that case, have at it! 

It is not as bad as you might think. Drill jigs are readily available. Just line them up and fasten them correctly and start making chips. As for the price of an 80% lower goes, the only attractive part is there is no paper work on it. If that is not the issue, a completed one can be had for the same or a little more cost.