Author Topic: The first contribution from a Yank in the UK  (Read 688 times)

gadget99

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The first contribution from a Yank in the UK
« on: July 05, 2014, 08:52:35 AM »
Hi all,
Here is a digest of the posts I have made in a UK Prepping forum.
I hope that this may be of use to someone.
Here we go. I am thinking that the direction I will be going with my posts will be broken up into subject areas. I tend to get long winded so please be gentle.

First a few disclaimers are in order.

-I will most likely be covering things that others have covered, so take what I offer with a grain of salt. This all is from my view point and I want to stress each of us has our own unique journey to follow. There are no standard answers to the challenges we face.

-If I provide information on a product or company that sells such. I only do so as a form of review. I have and will never have any connection to any of these other than being a consumer that has purchased and have come to the opinion that I am happy with my purchase. I will do this many times to illustrate my point on the "bulk buy" line of thought I have embraced. I also do it in the hope that someone else may benefit from the tireless amount of time I spend trying to get the biggest gain for the £.

-I will try very hard to stay true to my current guiding principles. I don't do Politics, Religion, Advocacy of Violence or anything that causes anything but constructive debate. I intend to strive to have a thick skin in relation to this. If I post some advice that you don't agree with, No worries. I remember a lesson taught to me many years ago by a VERY old soldier in a very hostile place. I asked "Did I do that correctly?" he answered "I don't know. Did it work?". The lesson is take what is presented and if it is of value, use what works for you in a way that works for you.

Ok, so on to the context.

This world of ours is a pretty darn complicated place. Prepping is indeed a lifestyle for my family. We have turned it into a bit of a hobby. This has allowed for us to approach things in a way that gains immediate value along with the value of a long term insurance policy. Works for us, may not work for you. So that being said, as with most there has been a great deal of discussion about what we are prepping for. We have come to a few conclusions. We have no way of predicting with a high degree of success what is going to happen. From personal experience I know that "Murphy" as in "Murphy's Law" loves to come up with as many curve balls he can to mess things up. So we are prepping with an eye on categories of potential. When looked at in this way we were able to understand that many times the threat did not matter as much as being flexible enough to be able to react well enough to be OK.

So we have concentrated on flexibility and hopefully a bit of common sense. No I admit straight away that we are just as prone to getting carried away with things as the next person. So we just go with it. So I may say we did something in our preps that you may think is a bit overboard. Take it with a grain of salt. At least we are having fun with our excess.

As has been covered many times there are arenas of concentration when it comes to prepping. These are things such as shelter, food, water, health and safety. What I hope to do is take these on in separate topic specific threads if the Mods are ok with that. If not I will keep it in this thread. Just let me know.

Not to the general philosophy. I am a firm believer that being prepared means having the tools and planning in place to handle what life throws at you. In a military setting this means that you exist comfortably in a world of semi-controlled chaos. The old saying "A plan survives up to the point the first bullet flies" is VERY applicable. So the big question. How do you do it? Think Tactically and Strategically. A difficult thing to do. Think of it this way. Layer your approach to prepping into the immediate, the short term and the long term. You can take this approach and apply it to every part of your prepping.

So I will be addressing my posts in this manner for a better understanding of the subject matter.

So are we bugging out or bugging in? Going lone wolf or trying to do the "community thing" like I wish to. Ask me the day after. We are prepping for all and any of the above. Resilience and flexibility are bywords for us.

Lets take the simple felling axe as an example. You can pick one up cheaply. In your hands it can accomplish a great deal. In the hands of you and a few others, it can accomplish so much more. It is robust and has a long history of useful utility. It is portable enough that you can carry it. So the conclusion? = Might be a good idea to have one. Do I have one? = Yep. Do I have a chainsaw? = Yep (I'm old so I want to work smart, not hard). Yet I know that I have that axe as a foundation to my wood cutting needs.

"Foundation" is a good term. We start our preps at the foundation level and then work up. This allows us to feel safer in a faster timeline. If the foundation is strong then we can do cool stuff later. A catapult is a foundation item. You can take small game with it. The more complex small game hunting tools can come later.

Think a bit like the pioneers of America if it helps. I fully recommend reading the Foxfire Series of books if you get the chance. Aside from being very entertaining, they provide a wealth of knowledge. The people interviewed in those books lived the life of doing a great deal with very little.

Finding what you need to fulfill your foundation needs in an area of prepping can be difficult, so be patient and think a great deal. Do you really need to buy that cool £200 tent? Think about the role that the tent needs to play for you. A tent is a portable shelter. It is also a temporary shelter. Yes it needs to be of good quality. I have yet to see one that will allow you to live out of it full time for years and last the test of time. So will a cheaper tent do what you need or do you only need a Basha? Is it to much weight to carry in a nomadic lifestyle? Eventually you are going to need more tangible shelter. So going with the foundation thought process. I would carry a basha and that trusty felling axe. Yes I have a machete and in my past life had to hack down trees with one. By the way jungles really suck..... Yet the machete is for brush, vines and the like. You want to cut down a tree, use the axe. Remember work smart, not hard.

The subject of clothing was for a time a sore subject in my house. Try and get a fashion conscious teen to wear army surplus. Now it's no issue. Once tried and liked things go better. Military Surplus is a great resource. It does what it says on the tin. I highly recommend using that resource. If you think you need 5 T-shirts then find a deal for 10 or 20. The price per item is cheaper. Remember Primark may not be having sales after SHTF. You may think that may be excessive. Yet remember resilience and flexibility. Better to have it for need of the longer term and have to leave it behind if required than to not have it in the long run.

I have seen a great deal of discussion on scavenging. I would never recommend relying on scavenging for foundation items if at all possible. They are to important.

Due to my past life experiences prepping comes a bit more naturally to me. so I do need to stop and think about how I need to word things when communicating our approach to prepping. As usual I want to put a bit of a disclaimer out there. What I am describing is based upon my life's lessons and experiences. By no means am I saying my approach is the best or only way to go. I post this stuff with the hope that it may be of use to someone.

No onto what I call foundation items in prepping.

We had a bit of a funny turn last month that relates to this subject. As usual I was looking at how far we have come in our preps and what we need to keep working on. Out of the blue I realized that we had indeed a pretty large hole in our preps. Soap. The simple and humble bar of soap was completely missing from our preps. This came about from my thinking about where we may be missing things in our personal hygiene preps. Wow.... talk about a bit of a ooops.

So I started to look at how to fill the hole. Now I said the humble bar of soap for a good reason. I don't think modern society's huge selection of cleaning products have a place in a preppers plans. So I stepped back in time a bit and took a lesson from the past. Once upon a time the humble bar of Coal Tar Soap (Referred to as Carbolic Soap now days) was used for all of your washing needs. Take a cheese grater to it with a few swipes over your wash bowl and you are good to wash your clothes or the dishes.

Now I wish to place the humble Bar of Carbolic Soap as the shining example of a foundation Item for prepping. It is cheap, lasts a long time and it does what it say on the tin big time.

so lets look a bit more towards the foundation building methodology of prepping.

Lets start with the individual person. Remember this is influenced by my military background.

Each individual MUST have a Rucksack. No matter if you are bugging in or bugging out. That bag must be of military quality and as large as possible. There is a method to the madness. The military quality ensures that it will not fall apart on you as quickly as the less well made stuff. Believe me, things will break on you at the worst time. The statement of the bag needing to be as large as possible is a bit of common sense. You can always tighten straps to make up for space not used. Yet on a smaller bag, once you run out of room your stuffed. You can only hang so much to the outside of a bag and stuff hanging all over the place is not really a good idea.

Now this Bergen has a very important roll to play. This is your bedroom. We will set aside a few items or categories for the moment so that we do not muddy the waters. Think of it this way. This bag and it's contents is all you as the individual has. This is your wardrobe, your bathroom cupboard, Your house, Kitchen and everything else. So you MUST ensure that everything that the individual needs is in the bag. This is where foundation items become important.

Lets take shelter as an example. Build your foundation. Buy a military grade poncho or basha and some para cord first. Then you can buy that tent you saw on sale. I have slept countless nights in all weather situations under a poncho strung between trees. It works. It is also smaller than that tent when packing it into your bag. So have the foundation item in your bag for when the tent gets a rip in it. So you see this is a having your cake and eating it situation. You have and use the tent, with the foundation being there if you need it.

Now lets look at what you wear. Pack into your bag two complete sets of clothing (one to wash and one ready to wear if you get caught and get soaked.). Then you need to add undergarments and socks. When I say undergarments I mean both t-shirts and thermal underwear. Pack for all seasons. Better to have it when you need it than to not have it. Remember this bag is the sum total of what you as an individual needs to have at a bare minimum. Add to this a healthy amount of socks. You cant have to many socks. Have a sleeping bag and a sleeping pad on your list. Make sure you have a personal hygiene kit in the bag. Keep on top of personal hygiene... Getting sick when the NHS is closed for business is an easy way to get to the pearly gates.

I hope you are beginning to see where I am going with this so far. Get on the net and do a search on the packing list for modern infantryman. This will give you an idea.

Now don't stress about the fact that you cannot carry everything in a single Bergen. Concentrate on getting the biggest bang for the space and weight. The Bergen is the last refuge. It is your go to hell option.

Then you can do the bigger stuff. Making a small pull behind trailer is a good idea. Or you can buy one.

Now in terms of food and water...... Water is heavy.... Trust me in the jungles of Panama I used to carry between 8 and 10 Liters of water when on patrol. So I have a good piece advice. Carry a days worth of water about 3 Liters in your gear ready to use. Then carry the means to purify any water you find to replenish for the next day. In the UK your OK for this.

In terms of food..... I am going to upset people here. You have three friends here. Number one is Rice. Number two is dried pulses. the last is veg of any sort. You can get by on the rice and pulses for a very long time. In terms of size and weight ratios for packing them, they come out on top. Add a single multivitamin per day to the mix and you can survive in good health. Pack these for a foundation. A Half cup of rice and a half cup of pulses (lentils, Kidney Beans and such) with a stock cube will make a meal that will keep you going.

With me so far?

Ok... So I have a bit of time to spare so I wanted to cover something while I had the time.

Whether you are buggin-in or bugging-out, you are going to have to transport at some point more than you can carry on your back. Ok... so the old saying "Young men work hard and Old men work smart" comes to mind.

Get yourself or even better make yourself a trailer of some sort that you can pull heavier weights. Look in a pinch you can bodge together from the wheels of a push bike and some wood.

Heck an old shopping cart from a grocery store will do in a pinch.

The moral of the story is........ get yourself the ability to transport stuff manually.

Hi All,

I am back for another chapter.

Thank you all for the comments.

Ok ... Last time I stressed the need for everyone to have a Rucksack. I cannot stress this enough... You have to have one that contains ALL of the things you need. One item you absolutely have to ensure you have is plenty of is socks. Lots and Lots of socks. Don't skimp or complain. They must be 100% wool socks. Trust me you will be thanking me on this one. Carry 4-6 extra pairs in your bag.

OK.... so where do we go next?

Lets talk about a subject close to my heart.

You are not going to be fighting WWIII. Forget it and start thinking about staying alive. Your most powerful weapon is avoidance. So stop looking to arm yourself to the hilt. What you need to be able to do is to exercise hunter and gathering skills. You need stuff to fish and take small game. Fisshing can be done with a simple setup of some line and hooks. Learn what you can glean from the sea. You on an Island so the sea is there. If your inland. Think about what is compact and can assist you in catching fish in your area.

You need to have the ability to take small game. There is a wonderful thing called a catapult. It has been used for centuries to take small game. Get one and a huge amount of bearings or my favorite. Small glass marbles. Here is something important. Practice using your catapult. Now lets think about this for a moment. With anything you have to practice.... Right? So what is going to be safest to do in your back garden? A bow, Air Rifle, Air Pistol or Crossbow? Your lucky if your neighbor does not call the police on you with those. Yet the humble catapult can be just as effective. Really cheap. Even better you can practice without getting in trouble.

I know this one was short, yet I get writers block like most.
Back again.

As I said before I have been a bit busy. I have just finished a trailer build and am feeling pretty good about it. It IS for the prep, yet I built it so that we can use it for our camping excursions.

Ok... So I have lost my train of thought in relation to what I order I am covering things. So I am going to just keep doing brain dumps.

I'll cover a few topics in this post.

Flu and Pandemic related stuff

Ok so there has been a huge amount of debate associated with this subject in the news.

So here is what I am looking at. Whether or not Tamiflu or Relenza are perfect. Remember that something is better than nothing. And for gods sake do not rely upon someone from the NHS to deliver meds to your door in the middle of a Pandemic. So we have invested as a family a course of each of these for everyone in the family. Yet we do not stop there. We also have on hand natural remedies that we use all of the time for our colds and flu. I suggest you do some study on the benefits of the following natural items. Echinacea, Hyssop, Garlic, Turmeric, Cayenne and many others. So what does this mean?

Lets be openly honest here. Pandemics happen every so often. That has been proven. The Avian Flu strains have always had the worst impact. Look it up. "Spanish Flu" I you think it wont happen then you may be asking to be blindsided. Now if you follow things as well as I do, you will know that the odds of an Avian Flu Pandemic are growing every year.

Now I do not want to leave this health related post with just the Flu. You have to be aware that there are other bugs out there that you need to keep an eye out for. Ebola scares the heck out of me and with a possible incubation period of up to 21 days, Oh yeah I'm concerned.

So what that means for myself and mine, is that we are aware of the simple things that can be done in daily life to keep you healthy.

1. Wash your bloody hands. (My kids have sanitation gel in their school bags)
2. Avoid being close to people that present signs of being sick.
3. Be prepared for the possibility that you and your own may need to hunker down at home if there is a Pandemic. Low profile. Hunkering down. So you need to have in your domicile everything that you need to make it for about 30 days. (30 days is just a sensible estimate)
4. Remember that if things get to a pandemic level, you cannot count on things working as normal. So have food, Water and everything else you need. Be prepared for no power, gas or municipal water. This includes sewage works.

Ok.... I will leave that subject for now. Remember to ask questions if you have any. I will try to answer.

I am going to sign off for today and pick this up later.

graynomad

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Re: The first contribution from a Yank in the UK
« Reply #1 on: July 05, 2014, 09:02:40 PM »
Great collection of thoughts, please keep 'em coming.

Re the "work smart" vs "work hard", I'm finding that I more and more use hand tools as opposed to power tools, for a few reasons.

a) They are quite, I can still hear the birds twittering while I work, and for that matter still hear any nearby vehicles.
b) Conversely nobody can hear me.
c) They don't require feeding, either directly or for the generator (we're off grid).
d) They are hard work, yes I consider that to be a plus. At 60 I'm in danger of becoming an OFF (old fat fart) and the exercise is good for me.
e) They almost never break, break down, and never refuse to start.
f) I just love old tools (ok that's not a good reason).

I still use power tools when it makes a lot of sense, or there's no choice (eg welding), or where I don't have an appropriate hand tool, but I'm building a container house right now and all the wood work has been cut and shaped by hand. It takes me maybe 10-15 minutes to rip along an 8-foot plank but I get a good workout and I'm in no hurry?

I went to use my chainsaw the other day, it's always been reliable but this time I could not get the bastard to start, so I got my bow saw, that started right away. I have now decided to buy a proper logger's cross-cut saw, yes I know they were called "misery whips" but my lively hood doesn't depend on felling 10 cords of fire wood per day, realistically I'm just playing at being a homesteader and trying to get fitter in the process.

Anyway I'm just presenting another view, I hope to be one of those 95-year-old guys who still chops his own fire wood, but if I don't make it a habit now I won't be able to then. I'd rather have a felling axe than a zimmer frame :)

On another topic, I have a "cart" that I use for carrying heavy(ish) loads



The large wheels make it easier on rough ground and it flat packs down to a pretty small package. It was designed to hook up to my pushbike (hense the curved handle to follow the wheel shape) but works really well as a general trolley also. It also has sides that clip onto the edges for carrying loads of many small items.


« Last Edit: July 06, 2014, 01:34:12 AM by graynomad »

Offline JohnyMac

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Re: The first contribution from a Yank in the UK
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2014, 11:42:55 AM »
Interesting series of posts gadget99. Thank you for posting them.

I keep forgetting that you are a Yank in the Mother Country and start to form a question in my mind when I remember. One question that comes to mind is offense and defense.

The last time we were across the pond I got into an interesting exchange with a cousin about violence. Apparently it is against the law and or heavily looked down upon killing a mid-night intruder so to speak.  :what:

In Manchester I got into a great discussion with two bicycle police officers who were sporting Glocks as their primary. They truly were amazed at the vast knowledge of weapon systems I had and actually owned. I chuckled at this, as my "vast knowledge of firearms" is average at best here in the colonies.

Or my favorite: We were in a very nice restaurant just across the GB border in Scotland. My nephew (who was 12 at the time) and I were discussing the benefits vs. faults of various firearm systems and ammo, when MrsMac nudged me under the table with her foot to get my attention. I looked over at her and she quickly shifted her eyes to the next table over where I saw a nice family staring at us with Sunday roast half way to their mouths and eyes the size of cantaloupes staring at us.

Being one not to take an opportunity to make new friends, I asked him what he thought was a better round, "5.56Nato or 7.62x39. He coughed and replied, "I truly don't know."  :facepalm: Before I could answer my wife promptly said to the gentleman's wife, "We are going to visit the Abby tomorrow...Is it as splendid as we have heard?"

After a short discussion on the Abby they paid their bill and seemed to flee the restaurant.   :what:

A rather roundabout way for my question Gadget99: What is the populous of the UK going to do when the SHTF for defense/offense?

I can only imagine the hordes of folks fleeing major cities like Birmingham, Edinburgh, Glasgow, London and Manchester converging on the country looking for food. The only thing folks will have to protect their farms and family are shotguns, archery equipment and long swords. Along with the shortage of fire power there will be a shortage of ammo for the few WWII weapons that have been squirreled away in country attics.

What is your plan? What are your neighbors going to do?
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Burt Gummer

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Re: The first contribution from a Yank in the UK
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2014, 03:09:44 PM »
Thanks for the "bloody" big post Gadget.  ^-^

gadget99

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Re: The first contribution from a Yank in the UK
« Reply #4 on: July 07, 2014, 11:55:43 AM »
Interesting series of posts gadget99. Thank you for posting them.

I keep forgetting that you are a Yank in the Mother Country and start to form a question in my mind when I remember. One question that comes to mind is offense and defense.

The last time we were across the pond I got into an interesting exchange with a cousin about violence. Apparently it is against the law and or heavily looked down upon killing a mid-night intruder so to speak.  :what:

In Manchester I got into a great discussion with two bicycle police officers who were sporting Glocks as their primary. They truly were amazed at the vast knowledge of weapon systems I had and actually owned. I chuckled at this, as my "vast knowledge of firearms" is average at best here in the colonies.

Or my favorite: We were in a very nice restaurant just across the GB border in Scotland. My nephew (who was 12 at the time) and I were discussing the benefits vs. faults of various firearm systems and ammo, when MrsMac nudged me under the table with her foot to get my attention. I looked over at her and she quickly shifted her eyes to the next table over where I saw a nice family staring at us with Sunday roast half way to their mouths and eyes the size of cantaloupes staring at us.

Being one not to take an opportunity to make new friends, I asked him what he thought was a better round, "5.56Nato or 7.62x39. He coughed and replied, "I truly don't know."  :facepalm: Before I could answer my wife promptly said to the gentleman's wife, "We are going to visit the Abby tomorrow...Is it as splendid as we have heard?"

After a short discussion on the Abby they paid their bill and seemed to flee the restaurant.   :what:

A rather roundabout way for my question Gadget99: What is the populous of the UK going to do when the SHTF for defense/offense?

I can only imagine the hordes of folks fleeing major cities like Birmingham, Edinburgh, Glasgow, London and Manchester converging on the country looking for food. The only thing folks will have to protect their farms and family are shotguns, archery equipment and long swords. Along with the shortage of fire power there will be a shortage of ammo for the few WWII weapons that have been squirreled away in country attics.

What is your plan? What are your neighbors going to do?

Thanks for the question.

It is one I have taken a great deal of time to think about.

Please remember that my plan is to have the boat. This way we can be far enough away from any trouble to make it manageable.

No lets address your question as the generic UK Prepper.

I will point out first that since the population density is pretty high over here. The population density to food reserves is VERY high over here also.

The population has been effectively and completely disarmed.

When SHTF we are talking about a considerable difference in the die-off timeline than other countries. If this was during the WWII Period and into the 1950's then my prediction would be VERY different. This society was never more prepared to weather a disaster than in that time period.

That was then and this is now.

In the event of a major SHTF. The population is going to experience a significant die-off very quickly. The key to prepping in the UK is OPSEC. Low profile passive defense and bugging-in. With the ability to Bug-out if required.

Being a pacified society, the even mildly tuned in prepper has a major advantage in terms of defense. Even the humble kitchen knife carries a great deal of power. Now I am a big follower of conflict avoidance myself. Trust me I am fully capable of dealing with trouble even if all I have is a brick. The thing is. Keep hunkered down and let the madness pass by.

Just because this is not a firearm society, does in no means indicate there is no defense capability. The humble Machete is one hell of a good tool. It also is a very good thing to have around in troubling times.

Due to the population density and the lack of resilience in the UK society, I am not really worried. As long as we can hold out under the radar somewhere for a month or so. Then we will have plenty of options of where to set-up long term.

Just my view though.

Rob

gadget99

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Re: The first contribution from a Yank in the UK
« Reply #5 on: July 07, 2014, 11:56:17 AM »
Thanks for the "bloody" big post Gadget.  ^-^

Thanks dude.

I am good at doing things ass backwards.

Offline JohnyMac

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Re: The first contribution from a Yank in the UK
« Reply #6 on: July 07, 2014, 12:11:10 PM »
I wonder how many .303 Lee Enfield's or Browning Hi-Power's are lets say "lost/forgotten" within ones property in GB.  ;)

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Offline crudos

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Re: The first contribution from a Yank in the UK
« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2014, 01:18:33 PM »
I wonder how many .303 Lee Enfield's or Browning Hi-Power's are lets say "lost/forgotten" within ones property in GB.  ;)
OI! Was cleaning me pistol in the middle of the loch and it fell over board!  BUGGER ALL!  ;)

Offline JohnyMac

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Re: The first contribution from a Yank in the UK
« Reply #8 on: July 07, 2014, 03:52:41 PM »
Ness ate it  ;)
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graynomad

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Re: The first contribution from a Yank in the UK
« Reply #9 on: July 07, 2014, 07:40:49 PM »
Quote
I wonder how many .303 Lee Enfield's
Possible quite a lot. In Oz my dad had one for years that I think he managed to hold onto after WW2, I don't have it so maybe they have disappeared along with that generation but maybe not.

Offline thatGuy

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Re: The first contribution from a Yank in the UK
« Reply #10 on: July 09, 2014, 11:21:55 AM »
Lets hope they haven't!

The way I hear it Oz is awash with 9mm subguns built off an Englishman's pattern.

graynomad

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Re: The first contribution from a Yank in the UK
« Reply #11 on: July 11, 2014, 07:10:18 AM »
Let me know if you find out where I can get one :), just don't tell the  C:-)