Unchained Preppers
General Category => Security & Survival => Topic started by: Kentactic on October 18, 2012, 10:56:58 PM
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Anyone else having issues ejecting 3'' shells in an 870? I run Rio Royal 2.75 00 Buckshot which is actually a 3'' shell and i find that they dont eject very well. I think its because once the shell has expanded it snags up and jumps off the extracter because the port is not long enough and the shell starts to turn out while the end of the shell is still behind the reciever.
I have no issues with any 2.75 shells.
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My friend has a Remington 870 and uses the 12-pellet 00 buck S&B. This is also labeled as 2.75 but is closer to 3". No feed or ejection issues whatsoever. Same with my Winchester Super X pump (defender). Never tried the Rio stuff. I will buy a box sometime and give you an update, Ken.
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My friend has a Remington 870 and uses the 12-pellet 00 buck S&B. This is also labeled as 2.75 but is closer to 3". No feed or ejection issues whatsoever. Same with my Winchester Super X pump (defender). Never tried the Rio stuff. I will buy a box sometime and give you an update, Ken.
Cool thanks, i need to find out if its my gun or the shit ton of Rio ammo i have. Not sure which solution is cheaper.. lol
It often happens when im port loading so im working the action with the gun on its side (port facing up). Maybe 1 in 5
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i shoot alot of s&b and its labeled 2 3/4 but its really 3" works fine for me
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my not so humble advice buy a shotty with a 3'' chamber hell really a 3 1/2'' that way you can untilize (sp) all shells. Not that you want to but in a bad situation you could. And we will give you a GREAT discount off our everyday low prices at www.homefront-defense.com (http://www.homefront-defense.com)
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its an 870 its rated for 2 3/4 and 3"
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Not a big shotgun guy but if its chambered for 3"ers and you having problems and its the same one you had all the problems with before............... Sell that sumbitch and buy a something else man. Im thinking of one whos name starts with a M and ends in 500. Actually I think there is a deal running right now on maybe 535 comes with a shot barrel and slug barrel at a great price. This is where I would put the web address but we dont have it on the site, its a special order item.
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Take a look at my gear review. "Sellior and belliot"
I'm guessing same exact issue Rio is not American made so specs may be slightly different. The S&B stuff was marked 3" but was actually 2 3/4 + 1/16 so at expansion at 3" it was actually 3 and 1/16th causing major issues with not only extraction but capacity as well.
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my not so humble advice buy a shotty with a 3'' chamber hell really a 3 1/2'' that way you can untilize (sp) all shells. Not that you want to but in a bad situation you could. And we will give you a GREAT discount off our everyday low prices at [url=http://www.homefront-defense.com]www.homefront-defense.com[/url] ([url]http://www.homefront-defense.com[/url])
870 has a 3" chamber
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Not a big shotgun guy but if its chambered for 3"ers and you having problems and its the same one you had all the problems with before............... Sell that sumbitch and buy a something else man. Im thinking of one whos name starts with a M and ends in 500. Actually I think there is a deal running right now on maybe 535 comes with a shot barrel and slug barrel at a great price. This is where I would put the web address but we dont have it on the site, its a special order item.
Ya... I cant go mossberg. Im spoiled by the ability to retain all magazine ammo while port loading lol. If i have any more issues not ammo or user related ill just get a police model 870 or something.
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Take a look at my gear review sellior and belligerent review. I'm guessing same exact issue Rio is not American made so specs may be slightly different.
Ya the ammo being 3" shouldnt be an issue in a 3" gun though. Im not in love with rio ammo. more so i like the price. Im going to shoot a shit ton of winchester 00 buck on sunday and see what happens.
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I know i make my 870 look like a pile of shit. But the thing about me you have to understand is i expect perfection in my weapons. If i have an issue i get pissed. I likely have few issues compared to many shotgun users as most issues with shotguns tend to be user error. But when i see a pattern of malfunctions i jump on it. I could likely have developed a short stroking problem... I say it all the time. The pump shotgun is the hardest weapon to master.
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Kentactic wrote:
Im going to shoot a shit ton of winchester 00 buck on sunday and see what happens.
[URL=http://www.smileyvault.co
That is what I would do. I bet ya' it is an ammo issue. I have an acquaintance who's 9mm wasn't cycling well-About every 3rd or 4th shot the brass would not eject.
I gave him a box of Federal I had laying around and the handgun settled right down.
Good luck!
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Holy bent brass Batman! Went to the range today, my ex-boss had a box of Rio 00buck. It gave his Remy 870 a fit. The offending shells in question had a spot (same place in all defective shells) where the brass was bent out at the lip where it meets the hull.
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What am I chop liver?
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What am I chop liver?
why what happened?
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Did anyone read my post? Just seems like I got skipped.
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Take a look at my gear review. "Sellior and belliot"
I'm guessing same exact issue Rio is not American made so specs may be slightly different. The S&B stuff was marked 3" but was actually 2 3/4 + 1/16 so at expansion at 3" it was actually 3 and 1/16th causing major issues with not only extraction but capacity as well.
Oh didnt see this for some reason.
The Rio shells are actually 3" straight up and then once fired im not sure i havent measured them yet. but they are a rolled crimp and damn that thing seems long overlapped down there.. for sure its 3.25" once fired maybe longer.
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That'll do it. Your exceeding the 3" chamber and its hitting the forward portion of your chamber and rolling it back into the chamber.
Like I said same thing happened with the S&B 3" mag.
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That'll do it. Your exceeding the 3" chamber and its hitting the forward portion of your chamber and rolling it back into the chamber.
Like I said same thing happened with the S&B 3" mag.
yeah...sucks though... if the gun says it shoots 3" shells youd think it could also EJECT 3" shells lol
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Well, its an American made gun dude. It does shoot and eject 3" American shells.
The problem is. In other countries people use a different caliber which is close to 3" but is slightly bigger. ( length wise ) It still works in American 12 Gauge 3" shotguns. So why change the specs of building ammo when they can hit their countries needs and ours.
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And for the life of me I cannot find the link to that info that I just spewed.... maybe I read it in a book.
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Well, its an American made gun dude. It does shoot and eject 3" American shells.
The problem is. In other countries people use a different caliber which is close to 3" but is slightly bigger. ( length wise ) It still works in American 12 Gauge 3" shotguns. So why change the specs of building ammo when they can hit their countries needs and ours.
LMAO... i just read this....then i remeasured the Rio Shell and it is 2.5'' COAL... so i guess if the standard 2.75 measuring actually at 2.25 ish would mean it is infact an American version of 3'' no? ... i think i was being an idiot or using the wrong side of the measuring stick or who knows... anyways COAL unfired on the RIO is 2.5" if it is fired maybe 2.75- no more then 3''.
But what youll find i think is that a fired RIO shell is much longer then the 870 port.
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exactly 1/4 inch longer unfired.
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y168/gearheadkdr/2012-10-19_204220.jpg)
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Well generally and I say generally because some companies are just off to do their own damn thing all the time.
But, when something says 2 3/4" or 3" that is measured after the fact. Meaning. It hits 2 3/4 or 3" after the crimp is unfolded. So if you measure it fired and its anywhere near that 3" mark. That's why, because even though the outside of the port is just larger than 3" the inside is what you have to worry about. The shell isn't clearing the chamber because the bolt can't go any further back.
Man, I have no idea how I know this or where I'm going with it, but in my head I'm making sense.
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Also, High brass low brass doesn't mean squat. It's actually just an advertising ploy that makes people think they are getting like a magnum load or something.
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All sounds right to me... so based on all that ill say once fired the RIO buck is no more then 3" for sure.
As far as i know high brass just helps with reliability.
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Yeah, the shell is total 3" but inside your chamber wall is slightly less than that. hence the hang up.
As for reliability. I don't know about that man, a lot of follow up pigeons and squirrels would say that low brass 7-1/2 shot shell ejected just fine.
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The 870 port is 1/8'' shy of a 3'' opening... even if you ignore the taper and how the shell must turn at an angle making it longer then 3'' theres still no way the gun can eject 3'' it seems.
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y168/gearheadkdr/2012-10-19_205337-1.jpg)
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Yeah, the shell is total 3" but inside your chamber wall is slightly less than that. hence the hang up.
It feeds INTO the chamber fine... its the ejecting out of the port thats an issue. No hang ups upon extracting from port on these rounds. only on ejecting from port.
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Do you run into any issues with American made 3"?
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Do you run into any issues with American made 3"?
Reaver im thinking this is 3'' by american standards. Ive never actually shot a shell that said it was a 3'' shell before though. But if this is 1/4'' longer then the american made 2.75 shells isnt that a 3'' by american standards?
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Didn't you fire 3" Rio?
If the 2 3/4 is 1/4 bigger what about the 3" is it 1/4 larger as well?
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Didn't you fire 3" Rio?
If the 2 3/4 is 1/4 bigger what about the 3" is it 1/4 larger as well?
the 3" i spoke of was a 2.75 Rio buck. Its in the picture. it is longer then a standard 2.75 shown above in the picture. Ive only ever fired rounds that were called 2 3/4. The Rio bucks true COAL is 2.5'' which is 1/4'' longer then an american 2 3/4.. im assuming it would be considered a 3'' shell by american standards. Sorry if i was confusing.
To put it all simply it is my understanding now that an 870 is unable to eject american 3'' shells reliably... atleast.... the american 3'' shell once it has been fired is longer then the ejection port is.
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edit
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Is it 3" chambered or 2-3/4
Cause dude. I've ran hundreds of 3" through mine without any issues ever. Until I used that over sized sellior & bellot stuff.
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Is it 3" chambered or 2-3/4
Cause dude. I've ran hundreds of 3" through mine without any issues ever. Until I used that over sized sellior & bellot stuff.
3'' chamber
Im not sure the gun cant eject 3'' shells reliably. But it seems odd the port is smaller then a spent 3'' shell. Even unfired it barely clears the port before the shell begins to turn out. I will deffinatly pay more attention and slowly eject a spent Rio shell to see whats going on. Im thinking the shell is bending as the base is trying to turn the shell but the plastic hull is still behind the steel wall. In theory this could release the extractors grip on the shell. Ill report back on sunday with what i found.
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Drop an email to Remington concerning some of your questions and observations. Although I have never sent Remington an email I have other firearm manufactures with a almost 100% response rate.
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Drop an email to Remington concerning some of your questions and observations. Although I have never sent Remington an email I have other firearm manufactures with a almost 100% response rate.
Eh... i sent them my 870 when it was jamming cheap ammo shells in the chamber. They "polished the chamber" and sent it back. the chamber still had color on it and the gun still jammed. I just had my local gunsmith polish the chamber correctly and im pretty confident that issue is solved. Any future issues will be sent to my gunsmith.
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Ok i learned a lot. First the Rio 00 buck is a 2 3/4 shell it just is taller loaded because of the rolled crimp i suppose. Same length hull as winchester 00 buck after firing it. Next all shells failed to eject properly when the action is worked with the port facing up (gun sideways) and at a 45 degree angle ish.... But all shells ejected good with the action worked while the gun is in a typical position. I suspect all 870's will fail to eject properly with the port facing up and at a 45 degree angle like mine did. If i slam the action back very hard the shells just barely fly free.
Ill post the video if i can figure out how the hell to get it off my phone.
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Looking at the video again i think maybe the cause is when i work the action and move the gun fast. the shell is trying to get away from the gun but im moving the gun so fast the shell is caught in flight back in the port.
870 Failure to Eject (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzKbebFh_cA#)
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I see what your talking about dude.
I just did it in mine and when I tuck mine side ways like that they ejected shells nearly hit me in the face. That's with 3" Remington shells as well as some birdshot shells.
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I see what your talking about dude.
I just did it in mine and when I tuck mine side ways like that they ejected shells nearly hit me in the face. That's with 3" Remington shells as well as some birdshot shells.
A spent shell or a live one? My gun ejects the unfired rounds no problem because of the weight.
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Spent. On both.
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Ok well i just threw a spent round in and it almost always forgets to leave the port when i rack it. Its as if the little ramp that the base makes contact with and kicks it out is at the wrong spot so it contacts at the wrong time. Oh and i put a low base spent round back in the chamber.... the gun jammed up.. i couldnt rack it out without feeling like im bending the action rails. I had to jam a cleaning rod down it to help. My theory is the low base and the extractor pulling from a single side makes it turn in the chamber and bind up. I pulled the barrel off and put a spent low base in and pressed it in hard and then with little effort the cleaning rod pushed it out.
Whats scrap steel going for right now?
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...Whats scrap steel going for right now?
Yeah, you could always scrap it and put the money towards a Benelli. [url=http://yoursmiles.org/p-m
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...Whats scrap steel going for right now?
Yeah, you could always scrap it and put the money towards a Benelli.
Scraps not going for that damn much i know that lol..
Plus a benelli feels like crap in my hands. Im sure its a great gun, but for me i cant get into it.
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So i took the gun back to my gunsmith and his final words were "well if you end up wanting to sell it let me know i need a gun for around the shop". I think he said that right after he said "well how the hell should know how to fix it".. lol.. hes a funny old timer.
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the old timers round here are looking to screw everyone too
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nah hes cool.
My choices now are
Throw away my Remington and buy a different brand
Get a different older 870 reciever
learn to shoot the gun without working the action with the port up.
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Dude [URL=http://www.smileyvault.co
There is a reason the only shotgun I will let in my home ( Permanent residence of course ) is a Remington 870 Wingmaster Magnum.
Here is the numbers for a birth year.
1950____*___ WW
1951____*___ XX
1952____*___ YY
1953____*___ ZZ
1954_______ A
1955_______ B
1956_______ C
1957_______ D
1958_______ E
1959_______ F
1960_______ G
1961_______ H
1962_______ J
1963_______ K
1964_______ L
1965_______ M
1966_______ N
1967_______ P
1968_______ R
1969_______ S
1970_______ T
1971_______ U
1972_______ W
1973_______ X
1974_______ Y
1975_______ Z
1976_______ I
1977_______ O
1978_______ Q
1979_______ V
1980_______ A
1981_______ B
1982_______ C
1983_______ D
1984_______ E
1985_______ F
1986_______ G
1987_______ H
1988_______ I
1989_______ J
1990_______ K
1991_______ L
1992_______ M
1993_______ N
1994_______ O
1995_______ P
1996_______ Q
1997_______ R
1998_______ S
1999_______ T
2000_______ U
2001_______ W
2002_______ X
Check your local Pawnshops and gunstores. I find them all over the place for about 350 bucks. Make that shit happen brother.
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other then overall quality control in earlier years being better, whats the difference between an express and a wingmaster of the same year?
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http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=247316 (http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=247316)
Post #2 says it all.
Fit and finish and some internal things. Also, if I remember correctly the entire receiver is from a billot of steel and an express is pieced together from two.
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i buy the hell out of old 870's for like 150 out here
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i see. I may just go for the police model. It has all the goodies to make it more reliable like a stiffer lifter spring out of the 1100 plus all the hand fit and polishing of this and that.
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the police models are like 400 out here, but they got lights and other shit on em
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All the police models I have encountered have had leaf sites and are not " Magnum " stamped.
I don't know about you gents but I just cant work right with leaf sites. I tried it on the FN Police, just didn't work out for me.
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I Emailed wilson combat... see what they think i should do... send it to them to make it right, add certain parts, sue remington for pain and suffering etc.
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You could go to a ..... (shutters in own boots).... Mossberg :P
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If a 590 could allow you to keep all the rounds in the magazine and work the action i wouldnt think twice.
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ithaca 37 is still the standard in fighting shotguns
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ithaca 37 is still the standard in fighting shotguns
35 years ago.
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Hey Ken, you ever thought about a Winchester super-X pump? (Used to be called 1300 defender). It has a recoil pad standard, chrome-lined bore standard, and just feels great in your stance. (Or at least mine). I think it's one hell of a fighting shotgun; I put a sling on it and a saddle on the non-shooting (left) side of the saddle. Handles like a dream.
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Hey Ken, you ever thought about a Winchester super-X pump? (Used to be called 1300 defender). It has a recoil pad standard, chrome-lined bore standard, and just feels great in your stance. (Or at least mine). I think it's one hell of a fighting shotgun; I put a sling on it and a saddle on the non-shooting (left) side of the saddle. Handles like a dream.
Sounds nice but im afraid to stray from the box. If it sucks i cant afford to keep buying guns. So i stick with the typicals to play it safe. Then again i went with the typical 870 and got shafted... lol... if the 590 sucks ill get a winchester. if that sucks ill get a single shot to saw the barrel of for ease of suicide.
Oh did i say im going to try the damn 590?.. ya i am...
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lol, [img]http://www.arrse.co.uk/at Mossberg.
Dude, try The FN Police or W1300 first. Please.
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Ok so an update on the ejecting issues. I installed a Non-MIM extractor and all ejecting problems have been corrected. Gun ejects rounds perfectly now. You can visually see the MIM extractor has more play and wiggle in the bolt compared to the Non-MIM extractor.
If your wondering if your 870 has the upgraded Extractor or not heres a picture to show the differences. Theres a bump on the MIM extractor that can be seen with the gun assembled.
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y168/gearheadkdr/remington870_extractor_non_mim.jpg)
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I not even going to go into the brand hater stuff, I am just going to say that you have spent time and effort getting this 870 sorted out. You will have to do that all over again with any shotgun you buy.
Stick with the one you already know buddy, you're doing great with that thing!
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I not even going to go into the brand hater stuff, I am just going to say that you have spent time and effort getting this 870 sorted out. You will have to do that all over again with any shotgun you buy.
Stick with the one you already know buddy, you're doing great with that thing!
Agreed. Every gun has its can of worms. Ive figured this one out now so id be stupid to start from scratch again.
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Exactly!