Author Topic: Handgun Carry Status?  (Read 2317 times)

Offline Nemo

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Handgun Carry Status?
« on: October 31, 2019, 04:41:10 PM »
Chambered, cocked and locked?  Full mag, nothing in chamber?  OR?

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Offline pkveazey

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2019, 08:57:01 PM »
I went to the Link and read most of it. The first thing that came to my mind was that I carry with one in the pipe. My equipment is double action with an exposed hammer set at half cock to keep the hammer off of the anvil in case it gets dropped on the ground. With that said, I would never carry with one in the pipe with a hammerless pistol. On a hammerless pistol with one in the pipe means its locked and loaded and an unintentional discharge is greatly increased. One in the pipe also gives you one extra round.

Offline Jackalope

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2019, 11:52:47 PM »
   I use an H&K striker fired pistol as one of my EDC firearms.  It is always carried with a round in the chamber. There's a trigger safety, and a passive internal drop safety system, so no external manual safety system.  If you pull the trigger, it's ready to go. 

     I do have some pistols with external safeties ( including a revolver), but for ECD I prefer pistols without external manual safeties.  About 40 years ago I had to actually point my firearm at a couple of drunken trespassers who were contemplating assaulting my spouse and I while we sleeping in a tent on our property.  I came out of the tent with the gun pointed at the two "gentlemen" and they decided they needed to be elsewhere, so the situation was rapidly defused.  Afterwards, I realized that the firearm had the manual safety engaged throughout the entire encounter.  That incident made a deep impression.  My theory is I need to be focused on the target(s) and not thinking about manipulating controls on the firearm.  Yes, training and muscle memory will help alleviate the issue, but simplicity is important too.  For me, I need to be able assess the target and be prepared to pull the trigger, nothing else. 

    The chance of a negligent discharge is minimal, if the shooter uses a proper holster, and proper technique.  The most likely chance of a negligent discharge is while holstering the firearm.  It even happens to "professionals".  There's a great U-tube video of a DEA agent shooting himself while holstering his weapon at a school.  Where I previously worked there was a "professional" who managed to shoot himself when reholstering during their annual firearm qualification.  He survived a .40 round in his leg.  On another occasion, this same "professional" drove off while leaving his firearm on the roof of his vehicle.  The firearm was recovered after a three week search.  It goes to show you that some people should not be entrusted with firearms.   

   

Offline mechmedic

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2019, 07:30:44 AM »
I have carried a Glock 19 appendix with one in the chamber since 2014 and have yet to shoot myself in the nether regions. Proper holster is the biggest thing. Than and avoiding unnecessary administrative gun handling. The less time you are messing around with it the better. That, and a few other reasons, is why I hate vehicle holsters.
If you don't feel comfortable carrying a gun with a round in the chamber, get training until you are comfortable with it. Don't carry something you don't feel safe carrying.

Offline Jackalope

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2019, 08:17:00 AM »
     Here's the video of the DEA guy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vfONckOPyaI    You could see that one coming.

Offline CJS06

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2019, 10:49:59 AM »
Every no and again this comes up.  How to carry? If you can't trust yourself to carry a loaded gun then you shouldnt be carrying. It doesnt matter if it is striker fired, double action or single action like a 1911.  There is no such thing as an accidental discharge, if done while handling there are only negligent discharges. As Mechmedic said if you dont feel comfortable carrying with a round in the chamber, get training until you are comfortable with it ( I would add that you shouldnt carry until then).

No modern pistols (properly functioning) when in condition 1 or equivalent will fire from....1. an impact on the hammer or back of the slide 2. being dropped  3. without your finger or something else in the trigger guard.  If either one or 2 can happen then you should have it serviced by a proper gunsmith or replace the pistol.  If you have a single action like a 1911 or BHP or CZ then you have a manual safety as well as safe gun handling.  If your finger or clothing or anything else gets into the trigger guard that falls under negligence.

Know everything about your firearm, particularly how it functions....It is the tool that your life may depend on.  If you are not sure how it truly functions, have it explained to you by someone that does.  As an example, a modern D/A pistol like the SIG P series, Beretta 92, etc have firing pin safeties, there is no need to carry at half cock.  Most modern D/A revolvers made since the 80's have a firing pin block safety as well.  All modern striker fired pistols use a striker safety plunger system (even the SIG 320 now) to ensure that they can not discharge when struck or dropped.  There are exceptions to almost everything so you should learn about your specific pistol.  If your edc can fire from a strike or drop you really need to consider a different edc.

Lastly, any holster from a respectable manufacturer will cover the trigger guard completely. If it doesnt then get a new holster.  A holstered gun will not just discharge, accidents happen usually when drawing or re-holstering.  This is 100% on the individual and falls under training.  If you fire when either drawing or re-holstering it is negligence not an accident. 

I carry either a S&W M&P in appendix or a 2011 in OWB depending on the weather. Always loaded in condition 1 (chambered ready to fire). 

Sorry if it seems like a rant, this is a subject that I take very seriously.

Chris

Offline pkveazey

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2019, 07:55:40 PM »
Every no and again this comes up.  How to carry? If you can't trust yourself to carry a loaded gun then you shouldnt be carrying. It doesnt matter if it is striker fired, double action or single action like a 1911.  There is no such thing as an accidental discharge, if done while handling there are only negligent discharges. As Mechmedic said if you dont feel comfortable carrying with a round in the chamber, get training until you are comfortable with it ( I would add that you shouldnt carry until then).

No modern pistols (properly functioning) when in condition 1 or equivalent will fire from....1. an impact on the hammer or back of the slide 2. being dropped  3. without your finger or something else in the trigger guard.  If either one or 2 can happen then you should have it serviced by a proper gunsmith or replace the pistol.  If you have a single action like a 1911 or BHP or CZ then you have a manual safety as well as safe gun handling.  If your finger or clothing or anything else gets into the trigger guard that falls under negligence.


Know everything about your firearm, particularly how it functions....It is the tool that your life may depend on.  If you are not sure how it truly functions, have it explained to you by someone that does.  As an example, a modern D/A pistol like the SIG P series, Beretta 92, etc have firing pin safeties, there is no need to carry at half cock.  Most modern D/A revolvers made since the 80's have a firing pin block safety as well.  All modern striker fired pistols use a striker safety plunger system (even the SIG 320 now) to ensure that they can not discharge when struck or dropped.  There are exceptions to almost everything so you should learn about your specific pistol.  If your edc can fire from a strike or drop you really need to consider a different edc.

Lastly, any holster from a respectable manufacturer will cover the trigger guard completely. If it doesnt then get a new holster.  A holstered gun will not just discharge, accidents happen usually when drawing or re-holstering.  This is 100% on the individual and falls under training.  If you fire when either drawing or re-holstering it is negligence not an accident. 

I carry either a S&W M&P in appendix or a 2011 in OWB depending on the weather. Always loaded in condition 1 (chambered ready to fire). 

Sorry if it seems like a rant, this is a subject that I take very seriously.

Chris

As much as I would like to disagree with you, I can't. However there is one exception. I have a Colt King Cobra 357 revolver and I am super, super careful to not drop it. If it lands on a hard surface and happens to hit on the hammer I'm pretty sure the force against the anvil would push the firing pin into the primer of the bullet in the chamber. I'm not going to hit or drop that on the hammer to find out who's right.

Offline Nemo

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2019, 09:41:41 PM »
Does it have a transfer plate between the hammer and firing pin. 

If yes, discharge without trigger pull will not happen.  If no, there is a minor risk. 

Nemo
If you need a second magazine, its time to call in air support.

God created Man, Col. Sam Colt made him equal, John Moses Browning turned equality to perfection, Gaston Glock turned perfection into plastic fantastic junk.

Offline CJS06

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2019, 10:16:38 PM »
Does it have a transfer plate between the hammer and firing pin. 

If yes, discharge without trigger pull will not happen.  If no, there is a minor risk. 

Nemo

Colt calls it a Safety Connector but that is exactly what it is.  The Colt King Cobra will not fire by dropping or other impact on the hammer.

Chris

Offline JohnyMac

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2019, 11:04:10 AM »
I carry a 1911 with a round in the throat, clocked and with the safety on. I believe Col. Cooper called this condition 1.

I carry my Browning Hi-power the same way.

I carry my S&W M&P, a striker fired handgun, with one in the throat. This hand gun has no manual safety but my index finger.

My thoughts are...If I need to draw my weapon to protect it is not a time to rack my slide or cock my hammer. Its shooting time.
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Offline grizz

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2019, 01:04:20 PM »
I carry a 1911 with a round in the throat, clocked and with the safety on. I believe Col. Cooper called this condition 1.

I carry my Browning Hi-power the same way.

I carry my S&W M&P, a striker fired handgun, with one in the throat. This hand gun has no manual safety but my index finger.

My thoughts are...If I need to draw my weapon to protect it is not a time to rack my slide or cock my hammer. Its shooting time.

One of my great grandpas was quoted saying

"if you're gonna draw your gun, you better bring it up smokin"

I've believe these are words to live by. Taking time to rack the slide is all time the BG needs to shoot you
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Offline Nemo

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #11 on: November 03, 2019, 01:11:12 AM »
Maybe I should have continued this here.  Or merger?

Nemo


http://unchainedpreppers.com/forum/weapons/what-condition/msg80883/#msg80883
If you need a second magazine, its time to call in air support.

God created Man, Col. Sam Colt made him equal, John Moses Browning turned equality to perfection, Gaston Glock turned perfection into plastic fantastic junk.

Offline Jarine88

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #12 on: April 02, 2020, 04:27:32 PM »
I'll jump in.

All striker fires I carry are carried with a round in the chamber. My 1911 is carried loaded, cocked and locked.
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Offline sledge

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #13 on: April 02, 2020, 07:48:32 PM »
I guess that I differ from everyone else who has responded.  The only firearm that I carry with one in the chamber has a firing pin that rotates with the safety.  I still check it every time I carry it.  I do carry 1911s, striker, and revolver pistols also.  Teaching firearms techniques for 35 years I came to the opinion that all mechanical devices (safeties) can and will fail at some point.  It is entirely possible to, and there is a technique for, racking a pistol while it's being drawn.  To each there own.  Whatever you feel safe and effective with.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2020, 08:09:39 PM by sledge »



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Offline pkveazey

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #14 on: April 02, 2020, 11:48:46 PM »
I'm going to jump back in and say one more thing. My EDC is a 380 with one in the pipe and kept on half cock and the safety is never used. I do that because if I'm in a do or die situation, I'm pretty sure I won't have time to think about pushing the safety into the fire position. I try to stay out of situations where I might have to use it but I can tell you that I feel completely naked when I am not carrying it. I also refuse to visit any state that does not recognize my CC permit. If someone said they would give me a million dollars to go to New York, Illinois, or New Jersey, I'd tell them to keep their money.

Offline Jarine88

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #15 on: April 03, 2020, 09:06:09 AM »
I'm going to jump back in and say one more thing. My EDC is a 380 with one in the pipe and kept on half cock and the safety is never used. I do that because if I'm in a do or die situation, I'm pretty sure I won't have time to think about pushing the safety into the fire position. I try to stay out of situations where I might have to use it but I can tell you that I feel completely naked when I am not carrying it. I also refuse to visit any state that does not recognize my CC permit. If someone said they would give me a million dollars to go to New York, Illinois, or New Jersey, I'd tell them to keep their money.
How you carry (with or without the safety) is your business. I do have some food for thought. Just as we train for everything else, you need to train drawing, aiming and firing the pistol from what ever method you carry. Start with an unloaded pistol or use snap caps. If you practice repeatedly, including switching the safety off and re-engaging it before re-holstering, you will create that “muscle memory”. Then, you wouldn’t have to “think” about the safety.
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Offline NCislander

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #16 on: April 03, 2020, 10:22:33 AM »
I agree about Carry choices.  It's kind of like PotAto / potato / pOtAdoe. Choose what works best in your AO.  Whatever the choice, learn and practice what you choose to be safe and be deadly accurate as the the need arises. Also be accountable in your choice.

I use a number of various Glocks. I'm both safe and accurate.

-NCislander

Offline Nemo

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #17 on: April 03, 2020, 11:31:03 AM »
I admit I own and shoot a Hi Point.  But read the tagline below.

Nemo   8)
If you need a second magazine, its time to call in air support.

God created Man, Col. Sam Colt made him equal, John Moses Browning turned equality to perfection, Gaston Glock turned perfection into plastic fantastic junk.

Offline grizz

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #18 on: April 03, 2020, 04:07:58 PM »
I admit I own and shoot a Hi Point.  But read the tagline below.

Nemo   8)

About your tagline

Its better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it
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Offline CJS06

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Re: Handgun Carry Status?
« Reply #19 on: April 26, 2020, 04:53:06 PM »
Saw this meme today and it made me think of this thread.