AR- 15 vs. AK-47

[Outonowhere]

                                  *facepalm*

I'm still waiting for that one ^

*Walks away*

 [url=http://yoursmiles.org/p-m

[sledge]

Yeah guys!  Why do we have TWO AK47 icons, and yet we have no, M4 or M16 icon?   

Not cool guys, not cool at all.

I'm sorry guys.  I seriously am.  I just can't help it. I'm LMAO right now with tears in my eyes and I can't seem to stop.  Somebody help me!  It's starting to hurt!            

[thatGuy]

We figured that we didn't need and M4/AR emoticon because a guy who owns a M4/AR wants for nothing else... but more ammo!

[NOLA556]

I was going to find out today if the Tul steel cased stuff worked well with my M4 because I was about to buy a crap load of it from wal-mart.

Well anyway, I chose to do my video response to That Guy today instead, but I'm about to find out soon how the steel case works in my M4. 

It should be fine, because mine is mil-spec and is chromed lined so it should be all good to go.   

I shot alot of steel cased stuff when I first got my AR. My rifle ate it just fine but you just gotta make sure you clean your chamber well. The only problems I had happened when I switched from steel to brass in the same session/range trip. the brass kept getting stuck in the chamber, i guess from the laquer shit that's on the steel cased stuff melted off and caked up the chamber. i don't really know for sure, but I stopped shooting steel cased and I've never had the problem again.

[sledge]

We figured that we didn't need and M4/AR emoticon because a guy who owns a M4/AR wants for nothing else... but more ammo!

I like AR guys.  They're faithful and loyal to their platform almost to a T.  I know it's got to be killing them to have you use an AK icon. 

Uh, oh, this is gonna start me laughing all over again.  I better stop before I give myself a hernia or something.

[RONSERESURPLUS]

SORRY ALL, i'M ONE OF THOSE ak AND ar GUYS AND iT IS STILL CRACKING ME UP?

RON

[Veritas]

SORRY ALL, i'M ONE OF THOSE ak AND ar GUYS AND iT IS STILL CRACKING ME UP?

RON

Same here.  [URL=http://www.smileyvault.co

[mountainredneck2051]

We figured that we didn't need and M4/AR emoticon because a guy who owns a M4/AR wants for nothing else... but more ammo!

I like AR guys.  They're faithful and loyal to their platform almost to a T.  I know it's got to be killing them to have you use an AK icon. 

Uh, oh, this is gonna start me laughing all over again.  I better stop before I give myself a hernia or something.

and I love ak guys, they make me laugh with how much shit they talk so they can feel better about their inferior choice  in rifles

[Ghost]

Guys, I'll settle this debate right here, right now.



It doesn't matter what rifle you choose, as long as you practice with it, a lot, and have a lot of ammo to feed it. And mags to put that ammo in might be a good idea.


They both seem like great platforms, and I'd be happy with either one.

[EJR914]

Guys, I'll settle this debate right here, right now.



It doesn't matter what rifle you choose, as long as you practice with it, a lot, and have a lot of ammo to feed it. And mags to put that ammo in might be a good idea.


They both seem like great platforms, and I'd be happy with either one.

Exactly!   [URL=http://www.smileyvault.co [url=http://www.freesmileys.or

[Dave_M]

I shot alot of steel cased stuff when I first got my AR. My rifle ate it just fine but you just gotta make sure you clean your chamber well. The only problems I had happened when I switched from steel to brass in the same session/range trip. the brass kept getting stuck in the chamber, i guess from the laquer shit that's on the steel cased stuff melted off and caked up the chamber. i don't really know for sure, but I stopped shooting steel cased and I've never had the problem again.

I have to correct this common misconception. Lacquer coating does not 'melt'. Hit up some spent casings with a blowtorch and you'll quickly see this. 'Poly' coated cases only came to the market because the US venue was so stuck in this line of thinking. Here's what really happens:

Steel cases don't have the elasticity of brass cases. This means when the round is discharged it doesn't fully form to the chamber; a small gap exists between the outside of the steel case and the chamber walls. In this gap, crap builds up. Now, along the same time period Wolf and other steel cases became more popular, the market with rife with South African battlepacks of 5.56. SA .223/5.56 is notorious for being made of relatively brittle brass. This means that when the SA brass expanded into the layer of gunk, there was often an insufficient amount of resistance on the extractor to pull out the round. Hence, the whole, 'no brass after steel'.

I myself run several rounds of brass cased ammo, to pull out some of the gunk, for every several hundred rounds of steel-cased. The Box O' Truth did an article about this years ago here:
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/edu18.htm

The rule of thumb should really be, 'Don't run [South African] brass after steel'.

If one doesn't have a properly-speced 5.56 chamber, the risk is much higher of having a stuck case. It is notable that when Hornady released their training ammunition line (Hornady bullet and powder in a primed Russian steel case) they went with lacquer coated cases (which are far far better in regards to corrosion resistance than the 'poly' coated ones). In short: Poly cases exist because Americans are ignorant.

[sledge]

In short: Poly cases exist because Americans are ignorant.

I resemble that statement.  I'd truly like to argue against any insinuation that Americans are ignorant.  Unfortunately, as a whole, we prove it to be the truth over and over again.  Obama is just the latest shining example.

I say we boycott those poly cases first.  Then move on to our other mistakes.

Great post Dave.

And 505, thanks for the cool gun sigs.

[EJR914]

I shot alot of steel cased stuff when I first got my AR. My rifle ate it just fine but you just gotta make sure you clean your chamber well. The only problems I had happened when I switched from steel to brass in the same session/range trip. the brass kept getting stuck in the chamber, i guess from the laquer shit that's on the steel cased stuff melted off and caked up the chamber. i don't really know for sure, but I stopped shooting steel cased and I've never had the problem again.

I have to correct this common misconception. Lacquer coating does not 'melt'. Hit up some spent casings with a blowtorch and you'll quickly see this. 'Poly' coated cases only came to the market because the US venue was so stuck in this line of thinking. Here's what really happens:

Steel cases don't have the elasticity of brass cases. This means when the round is discharged it doesn't fully form to the chamber; a small gap exists between the outside of the steel case and the chamber walls. In this gap, crap builds up. Now, along the same time period Wolf and other steel cases became more popular, the market with rife with South African battlepacks of 5.56. SA .223/5.56 is notorious for being made of relatively brittle brass. This means that when the SA brass expanded into the layer of gunk, there was often an insufficient amount of resistance on the extractor to pull out the round. Hence, the whole, 'no brass after steel'.

I myself run several rounds of brass cased ammo, to pull out some of the gunk, for every several hundred rounds of steel-cased. The Box O' Truth did an article about this years ago here:
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/edu18.htm

The rule of thumb should really be, 'Don't run [South African] brass after steel'.

If one doesn't have a properly-speced 5.56 chamber, the risk is much higher of having a stuck case. It is notable that when Hornady released their training ammunition line (Hornady bullet and powder in a primed Russian steel case) they went with lacquer coated cases (which are far far better in regards to corrosion resistance than the 'poly' coated ones). In short: Poly cases exist because Americans are ignorant.

Dave_M, you just blew my mind.   

[1000meterstare]

 [URL=http://www.smileyvault.coOh, I almost forgot to address the epitome and pinnacle of AR development:  the piston.  Sounds like the AR is NOW actually an AK!  Funny, my WASR-10 still doesn't need a forward assist.  OUCH!!!  Sounds like I just nailed somebody's mom, sister, favorite platform, or all of them at once!!! [url=http://yoursmiles.org/p-m

[Dave_M]

Oh, I almost forgot to address the epitome and pinnacle of AR development:  the piston.  Sounds like the AR is NOW actually an AK!  Funny, my WASR-10 still doesn't need a forward assist.  OUCH!!!  Sounds like I just nailed somebody's mom, sister, favorite platform, or all of them at once!!!

Piston AR's aren't the pinnacle of AR design; they are a fool's errand and wasted money for most. Except in exceedingly rare instances, they are totally unneeded and do not increase reliability in the system. Furthermore, they are outclassed by newer technologies. I would place the current vertex of design on either the Knights Armament SR-15E3 or the LMT MRP (DI version).

Also, the AK has a long-stroke gas system. This means that the gas piston is directly attached to the BCG. Every AR piston design I've seen has involved a short-stroke gas system (independent op-rod which hits the BCG). Additionally, the AK isn't the first rifle developed to have a gas piston--not every gun with a gas piston is a derivative of an AK-series rifle. Obvious more advanced versions of the AK would be the Galil and Valmet.

Your WASR-10 does indeed have a forward assist--it's called the charging handle.

[technique]

Also, the AK has a long-stroke gas system. This means that the gas piston is directly attached to the BCG. Every AR piston design I've seen has involved a short-stroke gas system (independent op-rod which hits the BCG).

Primary Weapon System (PWS) formerly known as AK Concepts. Long-stroke.
Honestly one of the best approaches I've seen yet, at least that I can talk about 

[Dave_M]

Also, the AK has a long-stroke gas system. This means that the gas piston is directly attached to the BCG. Every AR piston design I've seen has involved a short-stroke gas system (independent op-rod which hits the BCG).

Primary Weapon System (PWS) formerly known as AK Concepts. Long-stroke.
Honestly one of the best approaches I've seen yet, at least that I can talk about 

Years ago, when I actually gave some consideration to this concept, I attached an SKS op-rod to an AR carrier. It worked. It was also stupid. One of these days I'll post pics of my DI AK build 

Either way, I think we can both agree these are all far cry's from being both the, 'pinnacle' nor AK-like.

Here's a write-up a did a while back regarding piston systems:
http://www.milcopptactical.com/piston.htm

[Dave_M]

ADCOR Bear is a long stroke setup. So, I'll correct myself.