Author Topic: One Of My 2020 Goals  (Read 2566 times)

Online JohnyMac

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 15157
  • Karma: +23/-0
One Of My 2020 Goals
« on: December 27, 2021, 10:43:06 AM »
Each year I start out the year with goals that will improve life here at the redoubt before the SHTF. This years big purchase will be a green house.

It actually was a goal for 2021 however, other things took priority. One of which was the new solar system setup. Then Covid erased August for intents and purposes then my mom took ill. After 2-months of dealing with Doctors, hospitals, Rehab, etcetera, she is doing well and back in her house. With that written, five months of the year was shot. Moving on...

So reading the give and take between Jackalope, Felix, jgalt52, and others about greenhouses, where do I start? I have the spot now where do I buy a used or new greenhouse? What should I look for? What should I avoid? How many Angles can dance on a head of a pin?  ;D
Keep abreast of J6 arrestees at https://americangulag.org/ Donate if you can for their defense.

Offline Nemo

  • Hardcore Prepper
  • ******
  • Posts: 6550
  • Karma: +17/-2
  • From My Cold Dead Hands
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2021, 11:12:15 AM »
Five.

Nemo 
If you need a second magazine, its time to call in air support.

God created Man, Col. Sam Colt made him equal, John Moses Browning turned equality to perfection, Gaston Glock turned perfection into plastic fantastic junk.

Offline Jackalope

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 2481
  • Karma: +11/-0
  • Free Citizen
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2021, 11:41:20 AM »
   Knowing a little about your homestead location, I suggest that you look for the strongest structure possible, due to snow loads.  At my old house, I tried a hoophouse, which was fine during the summer.  I did heat it during the winter (no choice when the outside temp is -40 F).  Even though it was heated, a heavy lake effect storm still managed to collapse the structure.  So, Plan B was a small homebuilt greenhouse, which used recycled windows, and a polycarbonite corrugated roof.  That particular structure is 15 years old and still standing.  I put in a brick floor for thermal mass, which I'm considering to do here, as well.

    Part of your decision will be your budget, the monetary budget and time budget, with tradeoffs between the two.

     I went with the hobby sized version from these folks: https://migreenhouse.com/greenhouse-products/simply-solar-greenhouses/.  I was looking for a structure that was absolutely weather tight.  The base of my particular greenhouse is buried in the ground, which reduces the possibility of vermin, snakes, insects coming up from underneath.  I'd look at durability.  Automatic vents are an excellent idea.  One of the reasons why I went with fiberglass is the ease of repair; I keep a fiberglass repair kit in stock, in case something does happen.  When glass breaks, it can be a pain to repair, while the newer plastic glazing is much safer.  The small and mid-sized fiberglass greenhouses are one piece, the installation time is maybe 2 hours, and the manufacturer does the installation, so no exertion required on my part. Also, because it's one piece, there are fewer air gaps, so it's easier to heat.  It can also be moved, if the chosen location doesn't work out.  And, it has tornado proven durability.

     Bottom line, how much time and money do you want to invest?

Offline Felix

  • Committed prepper
  • *****
  • Posts: 858
  • Karma: +1/-0
  • Hunter, grower, brewer, distiller.
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2021, 12:04:12 PM »
My own little greenhouse was the result of wife hounding me to "clean up" things around the property.   She, casting aspersions upon what I considered to be a very valuable "Possibles Pile".
Long story short, greenhouse structure began with scrap lumber augmented by trip to Home Depot for that which I still needed but hadn't "collected and stocked on the property" yet.
For glazing, I went the "cheap" route, plastic film.   Now in its third winter, the wind and snow haven't damaged anything yet - the film is warranted for 4 years, looks like we'll blow past that.
Some of the design things I'll mention:
Roof is well pitched and the framing allows no unsupported span greater than 18".
I stapled the film down wherever it is in contact with framing and then covered all of those with painted lath strips, fastened with tech screws.     This results in stopping flex against little staples,    AND - if any one section fails, I figure the strips are easily removed, the failed section can be easily stapled back in place with new material and the covering strips put back on.
Oh, and I double glazed - added film to the inside of framing also using staples (but no need for strips).
An example of vendor carrying like film:
https://farmplasticsupply.com/4year-clear

Online JohnyMac

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 15157
  • Karma: +23/-0
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2021, 12:23:05 PM »
WOW Felix, that film is very reasonable.
Keep abreast of J6 arrestees at https://americangulag.org/ Donate if you can for their defense.

Offline Felix

  • Committed prepper
  • *****
  • Posts: 858
  • Karma: +1/-0
  • Hunter, grower, brewer, distiller.
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2021, 05:01:25 PM »
WOW Felix, that film is very reasonable.

Surprised me too but the price seemed OK since it wasn't _reeeeeeeally_ going to last long (I figured).
But the performance so far has exceeded expectations.  No hurry to switch to traditional, more expensive glazing so far.   :-)

Offline FeedingFreedom

  • Senior Prepper
  • ****
  • Posts: 349
  • Karma: +3/-0
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2021, 05:21:23 PM »
I spent a summer working at a local greenhouse, another one of those "we can only have you work 16 hours per week" jobs that end up with me working at least 40 every week.  ::) Anyway, at the end of the season, they remove the greenhouse film from the houses that won't be heated all winter and stuff it in the dumpster. I took all of it, and it lasted for 10 years exposed to the weather, and probably had a year or two left in it.

Now that lumber prices are down some, I'm starting to get the materials for my 26' diameter geodesic greenhouse. I chose the design because a) I have a thing for domes, and b) it's about the strongest structure you can build, it will hold any snow loads we get here, even without any heat inside. Plus the technique of constructing it in "modules" that I can handle and assemble myself is a plus. Total cost of materials is going to be ~$1,500, not bad for the area I'm going to get. I will definitely have to get a piece of shade cloth for the south side, to avoid extreme temps in mid-summer. I intend to grow some Okinawan plants that I could otherwise never grow here. I will cover it with film at first, and if the world doesn't go sideways, I'll probably switch to double-wall polycarbonate in a couple years. Hopefully have it assembled by the end of March to really get my seedlings going early.

Just don't fall into the "passive solar" trap, there's no real benefit to it, just wastes valuable greenhouse space.

Here is a video of the final assembly of the same dome I'm building. Paul has figured it all out to make construction pretty straightforward. https://youtu.be/g46XXsBnbrw
Socialism is the religion of the imbecile.

Offline Felix

  • Committed prepper
  • *****
  • Posts: 858
  • Karma: +1/-0
  • Hunter, grower, brewer, distiller.
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2021, 06:21:51 AM »
Wow, great link.  Time lapsed yet only 6 hours to assemble?   Climbed on my internet surf board and rode the waves looking at Buckminster Fuller stuff.   Found photos of greenhouse domes (one with raised beds in foreground) and was reminded of something I've been meaning to do to my existing raised beds - it worked well in Alaska (Kodiak), namely hinged covers.
I have one hinged roof panel on my little structure - it is barely enough.  And I saw only one panel opening in the video - be sure to hinge enough panels?

Offline FeedingFreedom

  • Senior Prepper
  • ****
  • Posts: 349
  • Karma: +3/-0
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #8 on: December 28, 2021, 08:23:12 AM »
Wow, great link.  Time lapsed yet only 6 hours to assemble?   Climbed on my internet surf board and rode the waves looking at Buckminster Fuller stuff.   Found photos of greenhouse domes (one with raised beds in foreground) and was reminded of something I've been meaning to do to my existing raised beds - it worked well in Alaska (Kodiak), namely hinged covers.
I have one hinged roof panel on my little structure - it is barely enough.  And I saw only one panel opening in the video - be sure to hinge enough panels?

Most of the work of his design is in the shop, ripping stiles and making triangles. I'll probably end up with 3 vents, which I'm going to fit with 12v radiator fans for cooling. Also why I need shade cloth, without it, temps quickly go over 100 in the house later in the spring. The house will also have a lot of automation, so I can control the vents and irrigation automatically or remotely.

Until now, I've used row covers for season extension and plant protection, you can buy or make a bender to shape 10' sections of conduit into hoops for them. I attach 4 of them to 2 10' 2x4 runners so I can move them more easily.

Immediately after the greenhouse is done, I'll start on my rabbit shed, which will be a far more conventional building but designed to efficiently raise meat rabbits.

Socialism is the religion of the imbecile.

Online JohnyMac

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 15157
  • Karma: +23/-0
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #9 on: December 28, 2021, 10:21:29 AM »
That was a great video FF. Thanks FF! It got me thinking (Always a scary proposition folks) and did a few searches. 

Let's put together a list here of some sites that share plans and such. Hopefully, we will eventually run across the plans of the dome that FF shared.

https://northernhomestead.com/how-to-build-a-geodome-greenhouse/

http://www.domerama.com/geodesic-dome-plans/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiYIVRB4QaA


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V96rdUOpsKA
  Part 1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7Skkw0gwRI
Part 2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UxCZaWX5s8&list=PLFxpwpnn4TgXKlMSVYk0pfaYD21i5psRG
Part 1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWeCGdwJU88

Part 2

Lets keep the ideas flowing...
« Last Edit: December 28, 2021, 10:47:31 AM by JohnyMac »
Keep abreast of J6 arrestees at https://americangulag.org/ Donate if you can for their defense.

Offline FeedingFreedom

  • Senior Prepper
  • ****
  • Posts: 349
  • Karma: +3/-0
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #10 on: December 28, 2021, 10:47:41 AM »
I have the plans for the GD27 dome, I purchased them from Paul last winter. He does metric and imperial versions of most of his plans, although he's moved on to some other methods of construction that I do not like. I think the plans were $35, which is good for me because I have actual drawings and such to show for my shed permit. He also has plans for a pyramid-shaped greenhouse that I'd love to build, although I don't really have space for it.
Socialism is the religion of the imbecile.

Online JohnyMac

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 15157
  • Karma: +23/-0
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #11 on: December 28, 2021, 10:53:20 AM »
FF, what do you think the cost would be for the GD27 dome? My guess would be under $500- when all said and done.

It all depends on space however, the elongated YT video i posted above might be better.
Keep abreast of J6 arrestees at https://americangulag.org/ Donate if you can for their defense.

Offline FeedingFreedom

  • Senior Prepper
  • ****
  • Posts: 349
  • Karma: +3/-0
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #12 on: December 28, 2021, 11:26:54 AM »
All depends on lumber prices- I budgeted $1,500 for the project, including lumber (PT 2x material), hardware, film, and a few rolls of greenhouse tape. I'm pretty sure I'll be under budget, but right before I buy materials, I'll post a list with rough prices. Also plan on doing a video of some of the process.

I went with Paul's design because I can build it from wood, it only requires 2 different triangles, and it's a true geodesic dome, so all the joints are in compression- once it's assembled, it doesn't rely on the shear strength of the hardware so it should hold up to some snow. Plus I just like the look of an all-wood dome frame.
Socialism is the religion of the imbecile.

Offline Nemo

  • Hardcore Prepper
  • ******
  • Posts: 6550
  • Karma: +17/-2
  • From My Cold Dead Hands
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #13 on: December 28, 2021, 01:45:34 PM »
In case anyone wondered about my answer above, 5 angels can dance on the head of one pin.

Nemo

If you need a second magazine, its time to call in air support.

God created Man, Col. Sam Colt made him equal, John Moses Browning turned equality to perfection, Gaston Glock turned perfection into plastic fantastic junk.

Online JohnyMac

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 15157
  • Karma: +23/-0
Re: One Of My 2020 Goals
« Reply #14 on: December 28, 2021, 02:27:44 PM »
Paul's design is pure beauty and an elegant design for sure. He is a true craftsman.

Does Paul's plans give you a list of materials? I know he offers an imperial measurement design which is cool too. Thx for turning us on to him and his product.
Keep abreast of J6 arrestees at https://americangulag.org/ Donate if you can for their defense.