Firearms in S. Africa

[Nemo]

See Below.

Nemo


https://www.ammoland.com/2018/06/south-africa-court-it-is-not-a-right-to-own-firearms/

South Africa Court “It is NOT a Right to Own Firearms”

Ammoland Inc. Posted on June 8, 2018 by Ammoland

South Africa – -(Ammoland.com)- Yesterday morning, 7 June 2018, the Constitutional Court (by Froneman J) delivered judgment in the matter where SA Hunters and Game Conservation Association (SA Hunters) in the North Gauteng High Court sought, and was granted a ruling that sections 24 and 28 of the Firearms Control Act, No. 60 of 2000, were constitutionally invalid.

The trial court had found the provisions invalid on the basis of their being (i) irrational and vague; (ii) breaching the right of equality; and (iii) in violation of the protection of property rights in the Constitution.

The Constitutional Court ruled that neither of the provisions was irrational or vague since the constitutional validity of the licensing process and the criminalization of unlawful possession upon termination of a license was unchallenged and that, accordingly, “non-compliance with the licensing process (was) leading to unlawful possession and criminalization”. Justice Froneman was rather critical in his approach where he said: “The gun-owner knows that he must either apply in time for renewal or dispose of the firearm before expiry”. According to him, the rule of law requirements of clarity and certainty were clearly met. The court then also rejected the contention that there are no lawful means to dispose of a firearm after termination of the license.

In rejecting the argument about inequality of treatment under section 28, the court ruled that since a license terminates at the end of a prescribed period (dependent on the type of license), no administrative action was required since the license expires by operation of law. This termination differs from other forms or license termination.

With regards to the deprivation of property argument, the court ruled that the deprivation is not arbitrary since there is a compensation regime for surrendered firearms.
A single-line summary of the judgment is: “It is not a right to own firearms in South Africa, it is a privilege – it is your responsibility to timeously renew your license or otherwise dispose of the firearm according to the law”.

In reality, the highest court in the land has now ruled that persons who have not renewed their licenses and have not disposed of them are in illegal possession thereof. Before rushing off to your closest police station to surrender your unlicensed firearm, we suggest you wait a few days for the police's reaction. We suspect that the Minister or National Commissioner may wish to tell affected persons what to do. There is currently a police instruction stipulating that persons who have failed to renew their licenses must not be prosecuted, hence we believe further instructions will be given.

If no such guidelines are forthcoming, we propose you hold onto your firearm and wait for the amnesty declaration. However, we do not know when it will come into operation – in fact, it is yet to be approved by parliament. Although we are extremely concerned about corruption and the theft and robbery of firearms at police stations, there is no other alternative and firearms may only be surrendered to the police. No unlicensed firearms may be disposed of through licensed firearm dealers or gunsmiths. One is not allowed lawfully to deactivate or destroy a firearm, licensed or unlicensed.

Persons who have never applied for licenses under the Firearms Control Act and who are still in possession of the “green” licenses issued under the previous Act, are, in my view, still covered by the judgment of the North Gauteng High Court of 26 June 2009. However, where a person has applied for and was issued with a “white” license under the Firearms Control Act, but this has expired, he cannot, in my opinion, fall back on the “green” license that he still happens to have. I am aware that there are arguments to the contrary, however, I am wary to rely thereon.

South African Gunowners' Association (SAGA) will soon be meeting with SAPS with a view to clarifying matters, especially the proposed amnesty and the enforcement of the law after the Constitutional Court judgment.

In the meanwhile, we urge members to ensure compliance with the law and make sure they apply for renewal of licenses not less than 90 days before the expiry thereof. Also, should you wish to surrender a firearm during the amnesty period, we strongly advise against carrying or using it.

John Welch

The SAGA Trust
P O Box 35203
Northway 4065
South Africa

South African Gunowners AssociationAbout South African Gunowners' Association:

The South African Gunowners’ Association (SAGA) is a non-profit, non-discriminatory organization, whose sole purpose is to represent the interests of all people who embrace the principles of safe and responsible ownership and usage of firearms for sport, recreation, hunting, and self-defense. Visit: www.saga.org.za

[Currahee]

You've got to disarm people before you can take their shit and kill them.

[Deathstyle]

Yep, compliance is self destruction.

*California example:
http://www.kget.com/news/local-news/member-of-prominent-farming-family-faces-felony-weapons-charges/1186514586

OAN did a report on an explosion of firearms purchases by whites in S.A. in reaction to the approval of land confiscation
by the ANC.

Prepare yourselves accordingly. Black market will be a patriot's best friend.

[Rogue-Metalsmith]

You guys
You have yet to experience the level of stupid we have to deal with on a daily basis.
This is Madness.
FYI... The UN has been present here in SA for the past year now... and let me tell you, they are out and about.
I am starting to feel like a crazy person.
I have yet again been deprived of sleep for weeks on end worried sick about all of this crap. ANd i am not the only one.
I have had so many calls and messages lately from people all over trying to figure out how all of it pieces together, and let me tell you.
"It aint perdy."

Thanks for watching the lines from your sides.

Especially Nemo and JM.

Kind regards
RM
 

[JoJo]

@RM Thinking of you and yours. Stay safe and good luck my friend.

[Nemo]

RM, you need to get you and him and a bunch of stuff in a box and ship it to anywhere, USA.

Seems like ending up anywhere here would be better than toughing it out there.  Except Chicago.  And maybe Seattle.  Or New York.  Or California.

Hail, just make it Anywhere in the South USA.  That should do it.

Nemo

[Kbop]

Be safe! 

[gadget99]

Keep safe all.

Our thoughts and prayers go out to you all.

Sound like a really messed up situation.

[Rogue-Metalsmith]

Morning everyone.

I am not sure what freaks me out more.
The silence before the storm or the thought of what the storm may bring.

Right now it seems eerie.
Things have been civil as of late but seems to have flared up again.

Slowly but surely the cogs that have kept this country going are coming to a halt. Yet again we have our national power supplier ESKOM in the red danger zone.
Things are much worse on the ground than what they are letting on in the media.

We have in the last week confirmed reports of several power stations suffering major losses and becoming unable to produce the needed power.

We have been experiencing power outages for the last week because of this yet on all the public groups i see alot of Police especially trying to downplay the situation to not cause a widespread panic.
We have a power outage looming, perhaps even system collapse.
Time will tell.

As fot getting out, it seems crazy to admit, running is not in our blood. We have been here for so long it is in our blood.
I know many may ask why we would stay here in this chaos? Have you ever seen a break of dawn more beautifull than after a storm?
I think in a manner the beauty of this place is what draws us in, it is deadly. But we stay for love of country. This is our home. If ever we should find ourselves fleeing from it all hope would have been lost in it.
Those that can will stay till the very last moment possible.

The razors edge is what we stand upon.

Thank you for your thoughts and prayers. They carry us in unseen ways.
God bless.

Kind regards
RM
 

[JohnyMac]

Yes R-M, the anxiety of the waiting must be mind boggling.

The canary in the mine is the local police. They will know before the average joe it is time to head for the hills.

[Rogue-Metalsmith]

Yes R-M, the anxiety of the waiting must be mind boggling.

The canary in the mine is the local police. They will know before the average joe it is time to head for the hills.

Hi JM.

Police are pretty clueless.
Here is why i say that.
Today we had 7 reports of large groups of people gather at strategic points all across pretoria.
It had to have been an organised strike action and no one was informed. so yes it was illegal.
However at at least 3 of the points they gathered nothing was burned and as far as i know no roads were closed at those 3 points.
There are at least 7 confirmed reports so far of this phenomenon.
Elaborating on large groups- it has been confirmed at least a hundred people minimum per gathering sighted.
None of this was on the news and several people ended up driving in the direction of the mobs.
The police reacted quickly to 4 of the sightings where violence was reported, the other three were monitored.
It does not seem like the police know what is going on at all.
There have been several township raids as of late to clamp down on crime. None of the reports reached the news however.

I feel like calling the ghost busters with all the strange occurrences since last week.

As for the firearms debacle everyone is waiting for some clarification on key points of the judgments that were given.
At this point no one is really sure what to do but the general advice going around is to most definately not give in the firearms to the police as of yet.

Kind regards
RM