Author Topic: What HAM Equipment Should I Buy  (Read 4585 times)

Online JohnyMac

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What HAM Equipment Should I Buy
« on: July 31, 2015, 04:45:38 PM »
My experiences of buying HAM radio equipment has been less than satisfactory.

This is a typical scenario that I go through when I enter a HAM radio store in my neck of the woods.

I decide that today is the day I am going to take the HAM horse by the reins and visit a HAM radio store to get advise. So I have decided to go over to my local HAM radio store in Warwick, RI.

After a short drive I find the HAM store, ABC Electronics's, and walk into the store with all kinds of anticipation. 

Upon entering the store I look in amazement at all of the radios and related gear that line the walls. Being an old retailer I can only imagine the inventory dollars that line the walls.

Sitting behind a scratched glass display case is a man playing with knobs and such while surrounded by a whole host of buzzing equipment.

"Oh boy...I have come to the promised land" I exclaim.

So I make a bee-line up to the counter and the rotund, balding man with suspenders sitting at the desk and playing with the gear.

I stand there for a bit and think, "He is so engrossed in HAM magic the man doesn't even know I walked in the store." So I cough gently hoping to get his attention.

That doesn't seem to do the trick so I say, "excuse me?" That didn't seem to do the trick either so I repeat my question just a bit louder and gently place my truck keys on the scratched glass counter top.

Eureka! This does it.

As he slowly rotates in his ancient wooden chair creaking out all kinds of loud squeaks & growns, he proceeds to look me up and down and says...Wait for it..."What do you want?"

So hoping for all hope he is my Hanshi of the air waves I blurt out,

"I want to get my Technical ticket but before hand I was wondering what equipment I should be working towards to buy once I get it."

With a grunt my future Hanshi gets out of his chair...Sticks his thumbs behind his suspender straps and waddles over to me and says..."Over there on the book shelf are home study books for sale. Once you get your ticket come back and I will talk."

I think, "WTF!"

Now the last think I need is another bloody Gordon West book. Hell I know Gordon West. I know him well enough that he helped me do the final installation of my SSB on Mad Max; back when I was the Store Manager of the West Marine store in Marina del Rey during the late '80's.

What I was looking for was someone to guide me through the process and in exchange for their help I would be a faithful consumer of his/her store.

Now this seems to be more typical than not when I talk with other folks trying to get into the magical world of HAM.

Well this subject line is for the folks who already have their ticket; what should they strive to buy for their first and maybe second base station?

Have at it folks...     
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Offline Shadow

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Re: What HAM Equipment Should I Buy
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2015, 03:44:25 PM »
I think Johnny that you didn't get what he was trying to tell you.
You claim to know Gordon West and you claim to have been around radio a long time and yet you never took it upon yourself to buckle down and study and get your license.

Had you known anything about radio, you would know that a Technician Class License is worth about as much as tits on a bull.

The Technician Class License is kind of like a learners permit to drive an automobile, which by the way is usually done by someone around the age of 16 - 18 years old.

So what this person is trying to tell you is that you look, talk, act like a CB'r and he doesn't want to give good radio equipment to a CB'r so they can play Prepper and use his frequencies when the world comes to an end.

I think I gave some advice on a different topic on this forum, so let me reiterate...
The Technician Class License basically shows some basic proficiency that you attempted to learn the rules and that you have some basic knowledge of electricity, electronics and radio.

The Technician Class License allows you to operate all bands above 50 MHz with as much as 1500 watts on some bands.
The Technician Class License also allows you to operate CW on 10 meters, from 28.300 - 28.500 Mhz, which is the portion of the band where 90% of all contesting takes place.
It does not give you Privileges sufficient enough to operate in the repeater portion of 10 meters, nor the AM.

Most every band has a segment that is designed for use by Technicians that can operate CW but not phone or digital

Take the test - ARRL test sites can be found on the ARRL web site or by visiting the web site for some amateur radio clubs.
You can also legally monitor any amateur radio frequency.
Most of the better clubs operates a 2 meter fm net at least once a week.
This could be your second source for information pertaining to finding a exam locally.

Pass the Exams - they are not hard, just two 35 question, multiple guess tests and then you will have your General and then you can buy any transceiver or amplifier you wish...

Yes, the vendors of Amateur Radio Equipment are very cliquish and do not like to sell to non amateurs...  Most of them probably looks at someone trying to buy amateur radio equipment for SWL as being someone that is wasting their time, because most people will not spend thousands of dollars to buy a good transceiver - just to listen!

Online JohnyMac

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Re: What HAM Equipment Should I Buy
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2015, 04:48:22 PM »
Thank you for your thoughts Shadow.

Here is a short (They are never short) JohnyMac story.

Back in the late '80's I was managing a West Marine store in Marina del Rey, CA. If you don't know, MDR is the largest man made marina in the country...Maybe the world.

Well one Saturday a customer came in with a AAA road map. The guy told me that he had rented a power boat and wanted to go to Catalina Island. He basically wanted me to give him directions.

I saw a disaster ready to happen so I took him over to the chart drawers, pulled out the correct chart and proceeded to teach him how to navigate using a compass rose, parallel rulers and a compass.

It took about one hour and the man thought it was awesome that I took the time to give him a quick lesson.

He bought the chart and a fore mentioned tools and he was off to Catalina.

The following weekend the same man showed up. His trip to Catalina and returned went off with no issues. He went on to tell me that because he and his family had such a good time he bought a boat.

He went on to tell me that he wanted my store... but more specific... me to outfit his new boat. We set up a time to meet on his boat to determine what he needed.

Bottom-line over about a six month period I sold him a Loran (No Sat Nav's then), VHF radio, radar, life vests, fire extinguishers, fish finders...The list went on and on. Within 6 months he, his wife and his kids spent over $20K. As a matter of fact I set him up with a "Big Boat Account" like his buddy Roy Disney of Peywacket fame had. This was basically a house account where a few customers were given credit and we sent them a bill once a month.

Well it tuned out this guy was a studio legal beagle. Not only did he drop 10's of thousands of dollars on his own boat; when ever the studio needed marine related gear, they went to my store. This generated again 10's of thousands of dollars for my store yearly.

I hope you see the moral of my story...If you are a businessman, don't judge a book by it's cover. The HAM store owner didn't know what I was willing to spend with just a little bit of help.

Now let's talk about the ARRL.

I have attempted to contact "designated contacts" that ARRL encourages newbie's to contact. Only ONE (1) contact ever responded. We agreed to meet at a specified location and when I arrived at the designated time he was leaving. He told me he had to go and couldn't talk to me. Gave me his business card and asked me to email him. I have and he has not responded as of this date.

Wishing to clarify in case you didn't read my earlier post thoroughly Shadow... I believe I wrote that I installed a SSB on my sailboat with West's help. Now you being a HAM guru should know that a SSB radio is a different animal and requires different licensing than a HAM radio. I used SSB radio's when delivering boats along the west coast and between Hawaii and California. Specifically "Ship to Shore" and downloading weatherfax info. I have NEVER used nor operated a HAM radio on a boat nor land other than my BaoFeng radio.

With that written, please remember that when communicating with folks on the internet who you have not taken the time to know, it might be wise to learn their life's history/story before you act pompously.

"Even a fool, when he holdeth his peace, is counted wise: and he that shutteth his lips is esteemed a man of understanding." Proverbs 17:28 ... OR

"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and to remove all doubt." Abraham Lincoln

Thanks again Shadow for your feedback and counseling. Wishing you a good day.

 

« Last Edit: August 03, 2015, 05:48:25 PM by JohnyMac »
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Offline Shadow

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Re: What HAM Equipment Should I Buy
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2015, 01:03:54 PM »
The FCC dropped the License Requirement for boat transceivers a number of years ago.
Basically your boat license and your Captains License  - like a drivers license for boats, allows you to operate a UHF / VHF transceiver on the Marine Frequencies.  Not quite sure how it works for the SSB. but there are Marine Frequencies that i know of that is just above the amateur radio frequencies for 20 meters phone.  Most boat captains have amateur radio licenses, since it helps when you are at sea and have an emergency, the sheer number of people licensed as amateurs makes it possible to usually find someone and give / send traffic.

There isn't much technically difficult in installing a marine radio in a boat.
Some antennas, such as a vertical, requires the use of some type of artificial ground plane.
They make a aluminum tape that you place beneath the deck of the boat and there are some other devices such as a lighting arrestor that you attach to the mast of the boat - if it is a sailboat type boat.

I already offered you advice on a previous forum, but for some reason, all you want to do is put down hams and stuff.

You can buy a Kenwood TS 590SG any day of the week - new - via the internet.
There is no longer any reason to deal directly with stores or idiot clerks and sales people.

My only bad experience with buying over the telephone involved a certain Ham Radio Outlet that sent me the wrong length of coax.  Which after some explaining, they made right.
Then before I attempted to use the coax, I checked it with a VOM and found that there was a short in one of the installed Pl connectors.
I chopped them off and installed my own.
The results could have been devastating to a new transceiver.
The salesman had 30 years as a ham and had no remorse in screwing up the coax and telling me that it would have been OK.
Being newly licensed at that time, I told him that he didn't know his butt from a hole in the ground!

Amateur radio involves Physics.
You cannot bend or break the laws of Physics.
There is some math, a lot of science, some geography, some earth sciences, some astrophysics.

Most people have been so out of touch for such a long time, with the telecom companies handing them reliable communications for a fee, ( not understanding how it works or where the technology came from ) that the average person believes that amateur radio works because it is some type of black magic that allows the user magical properties that magically makes the signals appear in their receiver, even when all non line of sight communications has been destroyed or blocked by Solar or Geomagnetic events.

Anyone that has operated any amount of time will tell you that all reliable communications is line of sight.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand that if you want to communicate with others, you need to have an antenna that is resonant on the band you wish to operate on and you need to have a transceiver with the filtering that can filter out the noise - when band conditions are not optimal.

The best antenna would be some type of beam antenna at a certain wavelength above ground, or multiple beam antenna's, co phased, at different wavelengths above ground for HF frequencies.
A rotor is used to turn the antenna or the tower in the direction desired.

The second best is some type of single band dipole antenna.
The problem being that you quickly run out of room - if you have to put up multiple dipole antennas at different heights for each band you wish to operate.

The third best - and probably my favorite, is the Barker & Williamson BWD 90 antenna.
It is a folded dipole that operates anywhere from 50 Mhz to 1.8 Mhz - depending upon it's height above ground, with a VSWR of less than 2:1...

Another option is the Hy Power Off Center Fed Dipole, either 80 or 160 meters, depending upon how much room you have and which bands you wish to operate on.

Worst antennas are trapped dipoles and a G5RV.

Feed Line is also important.
Big dividends are paid by investing in the best coax you can afford!
Why spend a couple thousand on a transceiver and then throw half the signal away in the feed line?

Power supplies are very important:
Astron RS 35M is probably the industry standard for a standard 100 watt station with a 100 watt HF SSB transceiver and a 50 watt dual band UHF / VHF mobile...

UHF / VHF antennas are very important - to buy the best you can afford and to put them up as high as you can get them and use the lowest loss possible coax.

The only cheap HF+6 transceiver out there that works is the Kenwood TS 590!
Never buy anything that says I C O M~!

Mid range new HF transceivers cost in the neighborhood of $4000 - $6500.00
The Kenwood TS 990 is basically like buying two 590's!

I told you how to find VE test sessions and to buy the books and study so you won't be a NOOB when you get your license.

What more is there that you would like to know?
« Last Edit: August 04, 2015, 01:05:40 PM by Shadow »

Online JohnyMac

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Re: What HAM Equipment Should I Buy
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2015, 04:02:15 PM »
AWESOME write-up Shadow!  :thumbsUp:

Thank you for taking the time to do it.

As you know people learn different ways and my best is by a classroom (Visual guy) supported with written materials. However, it sounds like I just have to suck it up and do it myself without the benefit of a classroom.

Thanks...  :cheers:
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Offline Shadow

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Re: What HAM Equipment Should I Buy
« Reply #5 on: August 05, 2015, 09:14:36 AM »
Two sides of the coin.

The first time I attempted to get a license, the club - school - that was giving the exams wouldn't even give me a chance to take the exam or learn the material.

The High School instructor didn't want me in his club because he probably knew that my dad and my Uncle were legal cb radio operators and that no one in my family held an amateur radio license or owned any amateur radio equipment.   Even though my dad had a old Hammarlund Super Pro out in the garage that I didn't know about!

Second time - there was such a thing as the internet and just by happenstance I did an internet search and found that there was "No Code requirement" and that anyone could just walk into a V.E. test exam with two forms of legal identification and pay their $16.00 and take the exam as many times as they wished.

I found a club that was operating a "Special Event Station" and they put me on the air and I operated it for them for several hours!  99% of the people in the club did not operate HF, and the only reason they had a license was because they started out as cb'rs, were freebanders, got scared when the FCC started to crack down in FreeBanders..  Got a license when they found a club that was selling licenses.  Most of them were probably only Tech Plus,  Tech Plus was basically a person that could pass the exam for General but couldn't pass the code test.

When the FCC did away with the code requirement and the Incentive License, the FCC grand-fathered in all the Tech Plus people as Generals.
Because they had no Elmer - ( Mentor ) nor did they want someone to teach them how to operate, they never progressed beyond acting like a bunch of cb'rs.
Their hero was a guy that talked like he was still on the cb, along with a younger gentleman that talks like a hillbilly.

When I came along, there was no one to play Ham Radio with!
Most of these guys have 30' - 50' towers and 10 / 20 meter beam antennas and double bazooka dipoles and lots of equipment for 2 meters / 70 cm and not much else...

There was no Ham IN A Day Classes in my area, nor were there any uTube videos available.
I read the books on my own, studied like a madman, drove as far as 120 miles one way to take the tests and I didn't stop until I held a Amateur Extra license.

When the Trustee of the club call sign decided to drop out of the club, the club needed someone, preferably with an amateur extra call sign to take his place.
There was only 3 people - including me, in the club that had an Amateur Extra Class call sign.
Their hackles were raised when I explained the rules to them and told them that if they didn't have a trustee with an A.E. class License, and if they operated on the A.E. portion of the band with their club call sign, they would have to identify once every 10 minutes with both the clubs call sign and their own call sign - which means that only 3 people could operate in the A.E. portion of the band and that their General Class License wasn't as good as mine!

It wasn't very long after that - that I had quit that club, along with most of the other clubs I had joined.
I started my own club, offered classes for all license exams.  No one showed up!
I had the first legal VE test session in over 30 years in my area - only 2 people showed up and only 1 person passed.  And after that person got his Tech - he refused to study for his General.
Why did he bother to get a license in the first place?  Because the Forest Fire Service in Colorado gave him some FM equipment and it bothered him that he had the radio but couldn't talk on it!

I got him a 6 meter transceiver - he never hooked it up or put up an antenna.

I helped him put up a 10 meter antenna - he bought a StarDuster - the same antenna he had when he was a cb'r.
Then he put the StarDuster 12' above the roof of his one story house!
Why?  Because that was where he had his first StarDuster when he was a kid!

I actually conned him into buying a UHF / VHF vertical.  I told him to buy a Diamond and he bought a Wilson - because it was cheaper.  As a matter of fact, he bought 100' of LMR 400 with the N connectors and then he cheeped out on the antenna and got the one with the SO connector and had to use an adapter - dumb!

I sold him 30' of Semi Rigid 1 1/2" conduit for $60.00 and he said that I should buy him dinner because I made all this money selling him this pipe!
1 1/2" semi rigid conduit sells in Lowes for almost $50 a section..
I finally had to wash my hands of him when he wanted me to babysit his mutt for a couple of weeks while he left town for training for his job =- Prison guard!

If I sound so calloused it is because no one held my hand and when I offered to help others, no one wanted my help and no one wants to do anything.

If you are serious about becoming a ham, you will buckle down and just do it!

I can explain anything that you don't understand, but I can't take the test for you!
You need to at least try to learn this material on your own!  Preferably 2 hours study time per a day for about 6 weeks would probably net you your Tech and possibly even your General.

Just studying the questions and the answers will not learn you anything or show you how to do anything.  Lots of people will study online - just taking the exams over and over again until they can get a passing grade, but very few of them if ever, makes anything out of themselves once they pass the exams..

Its not how many you got right or wrong on the exam, it is what you do with the license once you get it!

I joined ARES, RACES, became a VE, I had my own VE test session, started my own club, helped everyone - fix their house, their car, put up / take down antennas, operate for them during Field Days, visited them in the hospital when they were sick, went to their funeral when they died, gave them equipment when they had none and sold them equipment at a fair price when they could not afford to buy new!  I drove them to Ham Fests for free and I bought them supper and brought them food when they were sick and brought them magazines to read when they were not ambulatory.  I tried to explain to people - via online - what it is that is expected of us when we are hams and tried to explain to them the rules - as per the Part 97, but all people cares about is getting the license and operating FM with their handheld radios..

Of all the Ham in a Day classes our VEC has held, it has not produced a single ham radio operator!
Most of the people were Preppers.   They believe that after a disaster or during an emergency, there will be people there - on the FM repeaters, that will be ready and waiting to help them, or to use them as personal communications for their friends and family.
If you don't learn how to properly operate your equipment before a disaster, and if you don't learn how to properly operate - then after the disaster, there will be no trained people to assist you, nor will there be any sort of news gathering or reports.

For 90% of these people, they would be better off to spend $85 and buy a GMRS license for themselves and their family and purchase GMRS radios and operate legally..
It doesn't make sense to spend 100 hours studying for amateur radio licenses if you don't want to become a ham!  You could spend that time at work - being paid overtime, and use that money to buy decent 40 watt mobile GMRS radios and antennas.

Ham Radio is very expensive.. I have over $8000 in my equipment, and I will have another $8000 by the time I purchase everything that I want and get my towers erected and my antennas placed atop my towers.  And that is only if I do the work myself!

Amateur Radio isn't like my buddy Chuckie and his CB radio antenna system, just stick something up in the air and hope that it works.
If you want to be a communicator, your station needs to be in the highest place you can find and anything you can't make up in elevation, needs to be made up with tower!
I have almost 190' 0f tower laying out in the yard!

My 2 meter FM signal can be heard from Bradford to Somerset , Uniontown to Sharon, Huntingdon to State College and as far north as Emporium - with just 50 watts and my Cushcraft 13 element boomer on a 30' tower.  That is nearly half of Pennsylvania!
I must be doing something right!

Offline crudos

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Re: What HAM Equipment Should I Buy
« Reply #6 on: August 05, 2015, 10:35:29 PM »
Great info, much appreciated Shadow.

Online JohnyMac

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Re: What HAM Equipment Should I Buy
« Reply #7 on: August 06, 2015, 07:07:53 AM »
WOW! Great stuff Shadow and much appreciate the time you put into your posts. Obviously you are passionate about HAM and helping people.  :thumbsUp:

Being 59 years old I can relate to your story. It's the old adage that... "you can lead a horse to water but you can't make 'em drink".

Oh well, it just sounds like I need to buckle down and get started.

Thanks   :cheers:


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Offline CJS06

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Re: What HAM Equipment Should I Buy
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2015, 11:54:02 AM »
Shadow's post are excellent and probably some of the most informative, Thanks Shadow.  At the same time coming from a background as a retailer in a niche market the experience that Johny Mac had is unreal. You never know who a customer is and what he is willing to spend. As simple honest education, similar to what Shadow provided at the time may have lead to a significant sale. Now, once I followed the proper steps I would still never do business with that guy. The more niche the market the more customer service (not giving stuff away) become important......if you want to stay in business which is presumably why you opened a store in the first place.

Offline Shadow

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Re: What HAM Equipment Should I Buy
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2015, 11:00:24 AM »
There is only a select few brick and mortar stores left in the USA that still sells amateur radio equipment, and of those big 3, at least one - Amateur Electronics Supply - AES, has stopped mailing catalogs and has gone mainstream - online only, unless you visit their store.

Ham Radio Outlet too - has not sent a catalog in several years...

The question is - how much profit is there in selling a $25 or $35 handheld radio?

How many do you have to sell - per a day, to keep the lights on and pay the bills, along with the help?

The bubble has already burst.

Some simple numbers...

There are about 750,000 amateur radio licenses in this world.

At least 25,000 of those licenses are club call signs - not an actual person...

At least 50,000 of those licenses are no longer alive, but still on the books, because no one notified the FCC that they had died!

At least 100,000 of those people, is a ham in license only.
Most of these people either got a license and then never used it, or they got a license as a condition of employment and then never used it, or they got a license so they could use ham radio like a telephone and when the cell phones came along they just quit using amateur radio.

Another 200,000 has a license, but their only equipment is a handheld radio, or they never bought any sort of radio, even though some of these people holds an amateur extra class license.
Some did it because their husband belonged to an amateur radio club and they didn't want to be excluded.  Some did it so they could teach license classes.  Some did it so they could become Volunteer Examiners, but they never operated a ham radio.  Some were semi active hams, but they had to move to a rest home or high rise and they just kept up their license, but they don't operate anymore.

That eliminated 375,000 license call signs.

65% of all licenses are only Technician - so we have to assume that 150,000 of these remaining licenses are only technicians.  They are delegated to frequencies above 28.300 MHz unless they know how to operate CW.

So 225,000 licenses is all that is left - these are the people you hear on HF and the higher frequencies.

So if you only have 375,000 people that at one time in their life is in the market to buy a new transceiver, how many transceivers a year will you sell when eBay offers them for less money or free shipping, or no sales tax.

Amateur Radio is at least 100 years old!
Manufacturers have been making modern radio equipment since at least the 1960's.
Divide how many licensed amateurs we had in 1960 - lets say 300,000 by how many licensed amateurs we have today, lets say 400,000 and since some people owns more than one HF transceiver, lets say there is 800,000 HF transceivers in the USA.

Out of those 800,000 - probably 150,000 are DOA - dead on arrival...
That means that there is more HF transceivers then there is people.

The only way to attract new customers is by offering a new model that does something better than the older model, or by increasing or decreasing the cost of the new transceiver.

Vanity - someone that has money and thinks that they can buy their way into amateur radio.
They will spend thousands of dollars on new HF transceivers, new / bigger amplifiers, a large tower, a big beam antenna, or even just a G5RV on a telephone pole.
 watts.

This is why ICOM equipment is so attractive to the new ham.
The IC 7600, 7700, 7800 offers a flashy multi colored display, with lots of bling, and things the new operator probably doesn't even understand, but appeases the CB'r inside of him that wants a big flashy radio...

The Kenwood's are more utility type transceivers, you turn them on and they work!

Yaesu is for someone that just wants to be different....

As a retailer, you have to ask yourself, how many can I afford to keep on stock?
 Is the model going to change tomorrow? 
Will I get stuck trying to sell a model no longer in production to someone that is holding off - waiting for the newer model to come out...
How much money will I loose before I close my doors?

The Brick and Mortar retailer is under a lot of stress....

A Internet sales web site, doesn't physically own the equipment.
A internet sales web site doesn't have any major overhead, gas, water, electric, rent, insurance - to keep a store open.
A internet sales web site can take orders, broker a deal with the wholesalers, have it direct shipped to the customer, collect the profits and not take any of the risk!

A lot of retailers are getting screwed right now!

The new customer comes in to the store, looks at and tries the new transceiver, then walks out the door, goes home, orders it online for a few dollars less - and they think that they were a smart consumer.  When it breaks or they don't know how to use it, they walk back to the brick and mortar store and they demand the retailer return their product back to the manufacturer for warranty work or to have it repaired, when the brick and mortar store did not sell it to them and never made a thin dime on the sale..

Online JohnyMac

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Re: What HAM Equipment Should I Buy
« Reply #10 on: August 12, 2015, 12:42:00 PM »
Great analysis Shadow.

In the marine world, specifically the Electronics dept. is very similar. The cost of inventory is prohibitive to carry much breath or depth in 90% of a chains stores.

Talking about West Marine, there is typically one store (Largest volume store) within a 10-14 store district that has breath & depth while the other stores have a token offering and maybe only 1/1 or at best 1/2 min/maxes. 

The money to make is not in the actual electronic item but the accessories you sell when someone buys it. Wire, Pl connectors, speakers, antennas, etc. Name brand electronics may get you 15% margin while house brands you may see as much as 40% margins.
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Offline Shadow

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Re: What HAM Equipment Should I Buy
« Reply #11 on: August 12, 2015, 03:57:26 PM »
Before EBAY - there was an article in '73 Magazine - I believe in the 1980's, when the Marine Band radios went VHF and a lot of the older HF equipment was being phased out.
The article I read showed a person how to modify those radios so they would operate in the amateur portion of the bands.. A way to make a cheap HF radio out of a cast off marine band transceiver.

There were other articles written back then that explained how to replace on crystal in a CB radio and turn it into a dandy 10 meter transceiver.
I have bought old mobile CB radios at yard sales for as little as $1.00 that still worked...
Even if you had to put $40.00 into it to get it to work on 10 meters, it is still better than spending $100.00 on a radio that might get broke, lost, stolen, or damaged from an EMP...

It could be possible, if you found someone that was an Electronic Tech to build a bunch of these radios and move them off the Citizens Band to a frequency not allocated to amateur radio and use those radios in an emergency for a small group of people.

The hams will only be concerned with stuff that happens on their allocated frequencies, not something that hasn't been used in 30 years by the Forest Fire Service or Civil Air Patrol...