NVG's

[JohnyMac]

I am starting to research NVG's. To help me get started who would like to share their opinions on...

Monocular or Bi-ocular?
Gen I,II, OR III?
Brands - Good, Better & Best?

[thatGuy]

Night Time Prepping, by Unchained Preppers

[JohnyMac]

Thx TG I found this topic and thread line earlier today when I did a search. I was hoping for more of a 'Baofeng' ham radio opinion piece on NVG's; however a good start to the discussion.

I also found a topic where Technique was selling a pair or two awhile back. Again I am six months or so away from my purchase so just gather what info I can. 

[thatGuy]

I threw up the link because I'd posted a lot of good info about the different types of NVD/NODs. Thought it would make a good primer on the topic.

Now that you're primed, check out Optics Planet. They have all manner of NVD/NODs, great technical info and piles of good reviews on product.

[JohnyMac]

Great idea TG!

I have already purchased some stuff from them and their prices were reasonable. 

[Jeremy Knauff]

FWIW?you lose all depth perception with monos. Back when we had the AN/PVS 7Bs, I would keep mine tucked away until we were sitting still at a patrol base, in an OP, or on an ambush site. Also, keep in mind that once you use them, it's going to be a good 30 minutes or more before you can see anything without them. (Your eyes need to readjust.) It will take even longer is you smoke, dip, or drink caffeine.

[JohnyMac]

Thx Jeremy.

I don't smoke or dip but a will have a cup or 2 of coffee in the AM. 

[USMC0331]

Added to the original thread.  If money is no object... a PVS14 from TNVC.com is what I would get.  My friend has one I've played with and it's the bomb.

TNVC.com is known for taking care of their customers also.  Might be $50.00 more, but worth it.

[JohnyMac]

Thx DVC.

Well it looks like the PVS-14's are monocular. The benefits of a Monocular is one eye is light blind when turned off and the other isn't - Got it!

I ran across these Night Owl Tactical Goggles G-1 NOBG1 at Optics Planet. I need to look at the benefits of Gen 1 vs. Gen 3. I will report back.

On a different point many years ago (Mid '90's) when I was working for West Marine, I was visiting the home office and shooting the bull with a few Category Managers (Buyers). They just got in Russian Night Vision goggles to check out. They were binocular and big and heavy. We all ran into a office with no windows to try 'em out which we did. Well they SUCKED!

Although they did a good job illuminating all of us in the room, the images were not in focus. When you walked around they made you feel dizzy. And if I remember the battery life was very short.

Well once we left the office we named them the "Shluck-na-cofts!" Through them back into the box they came in and decided they would not be part of WM's inventory. 

Well any way...My education continues. 

[Currahee]

There is no benefit of GEN1 over GEN3 except cost, anything not GEN3 is pretty much a toy except for very specific purposes...

I would ditto DVC's remark that the best way to go is a PVS14 monocular from TNVC.

[USMC0331]

Kinda harsh Currahee.  I know I can see a lot more with Gen1 than the naked eye and that is a multiplier in my book.  For $500 (SPARK) it's worth more to me then another rifle or $500 worth of food if I've already got 3 months worth. 

The cost/value of the PVS14 is not worth it over the SPARK to me as a prepper though and will stay at the bottom of my wish list until I'm able to grow my own food and live off grid.

[Currahee]

Well, I'll admit to being a harsh guy, but it comes from a couple of recent weekends running around in the woods with PVS14s vs some of the $200 stuff. (And I own what was one of the better $200 units)

I have never seen the SPARK but just looked it up.  I would like to hear more but my first question is, how good is the performance WITHOUT the illuminator on.  Needing the illuminator is a deal breaker IMO.

[USMC0331]

I've done a few vids on the SPARK but the camera does not capture the quality of it without an IR.

It is 3X better than a $200 model I tried initially. My only other comparison is the PVS14 from TNVC so that's really not fair at all.

I'm going to borrow the PVS again and do some real world testing but likely will not include video as its not representative enough.

Armasight calls it Gen1+ and that is a fair label IMO. It's about 3/4 of the way if I had to guess based on vids of gen2 online.

It's the only poorman option worth the money out there IMO.

I'll be buying thermal before a PVS14 though.

[tominphx]

I bought my pvs14 from TNVC, along with an IS laser and such.  I have a panteao account, and I can stream the NVG IR skill builder video sometime for everyone.

[USMC0331]

Well, I'll admit to being a harsh guy, but it comes from a couple of recent weekends running around in the woods with PVS14s vs some of the $200 stuff. (And I own what was one of the better $200 units)

I have never seen the SPARK but just looked it up.  I would like to hear more but my first question is, how good is the performance WITHOUT the illuminator on.  Needing the illuminator is a deal breaker IMO.

Now that you own one, what are your answers?

[Currahee]

I have held the SPARK up against a couple of different commercial GEN1 units and it blows them away.

I have compared it to a good PVS14 (all PVS14s are not equal) and would say that - in conditions that favor the PVS 14 (overcast or no moon) the SPARK does about 20% of what a PVS does.  In conditions that favor the SPARK (crescent moon, or neighborhood with some lights) the SPARK is about 30-40% of what a PVS does.  This is WITHOUT an IR illuminator.

I have two different illuminators, the one on the unit itself which helps inside a house, and one that will allow me to see 100 yards in close to absolute darkness (Cree drop in unit) Of course we know that using the illuminator surrenders your advantage if the bad guys have  NODs too.

[USMC0331]

Well described. I would agree with the comparison completely and I have the Cree 6pm drop in also.

Nice to hear someone else review it with proper expectation of a gen1 unit.

[JohnyMac]

Hey Currahee?

What helmet are you rocking?

[Currahee]

Protec

Eventually I will do a video on the whole rig

[JohnyMac]

Protec?

Funny story: I was swapping emails with Max Velocity and he was adamant that everyone should wear a helmet for a list of reasons:

> Fixing a monocular NVG,
> Prevention of concussion from during a CQB or running through the woods,
> Etc.

He went on to write that if you can't afford a kevlar helmet buy a Protec helmet. His feeling's was that it will do all a kevar helmet would do but stop a bullet.
 

[special-k]

A while back I remember going on a search to find the helmets sported by the Delta-Force guys in the movie "Black Hawk Down"... come to find out they were Protec brand helmets.  I posted about it somewhere on this forum a long time ago.

EDIT:  Found it >>>  http://unchainedpreppers.com/forum/gear-review/bw-brain-bucket/msg28954/#msg28954

[JohnyMac]

There you go 

[Currahee]

Protec makes skateboard helmets and did in fact make the first run of military "bump" helmets ala Delta Force in BHD.

This is specifically the military Protech, the suspension system is far diferent, more secure, from the skateboard helmets. It has to be if you want that extra weight on the front of your helmet.  This helmet costs $60-70 where the skateboards helmets are $40 or so.

The real "cool guy" helmets now are made by Opscore and run around $400.

Mounting NVGs to the helmet is another big expense.

[TexasR.N.]

I would ditto DVC's remark that the best way to go is a PVS14 monocular from TNVC.

I have been fortunate to get some time in with the PVS14, they are an outstanding product.   I have also had the opportunity to use some thermal imaging equipment and found it to be very impressive,

[Currahee]

good overview of helmets (keep in mind, his OpsCore is a knock off the real one is around $300)

Bump Helmet Overview: Emerson OpsCore, Protec Alpha Half Shell, Airsoft