Unchained Preppers
General Category => Security & Survival => Topic started by: Kentactic on April 20, 2012, 02:25:01 AM
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All the guys always wondering about what it takes to build a "sniper rifle" as cheap as possibly acceptable.. here it is.
Budget Sniper Rifle (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EHjoj9TZ9U#)
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It's actually a really good video.
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Come on bros you know I can't watch the videos.. Whats it say, whats it say.. I wanna cheap sniper rifle too.. I wanna shoot 1000 yards.. I wanna.. I wanna.
No but really what does Mr. Yeager say about it?
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Come on bros you know I can't watch the videos.. Whats it say, whats it say.. I wanna cheap sniper rifle too.. I wanna shoot 1000 yards.. I wanna.. I wanna.
No but really what does Mr. Yeager say about it?
Well first you're going to have to buy a savage lol
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okay this sucks, first buy a h and r handi rifle, second get some spray paint and third get a cheap scope and there you go u have it for around 300 dollars http://www.arrse.co.uk/at (http://www.smileyvault.co a savage 10 will run you around 600 these days [img)
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okay this sucks, first buy a h and r handi rifle, second get some spray paint and third get a cheap scope and there you go u have it for around 300 dollars [url]http://www.arrse.co.uk/at[/url]
([url]http://www.smileyvault.co[/url] a savage 10 will run you around 600 these days [img)
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why have a single shot?
why buy an $80 scope?
i want something that will outshoot me.
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okay this sucks, first buy a h and r handi rifle, second get some spray paint and third get a cheap scope and there you go u have it for around 300 dollars [url]http://www.arrse.co.uk/at[/url]
([url]http://www.smileyvault.co[/url] a savage 10 will run you around 600 these days [img)
thats not a precision rifle.... even if it does shoot accurate for some strange reason once you leave the nice clean range and actually start doing things a sniper does with his rifle to go where he needs to go your rifle is no longer zero'd even if the pile of junk scope your using some how does have the required features and magically holds a zero when moving the turrets around. let me put it this way..the setup your describing is 100 yard budget deer gun at best... its almost not worth trying to explain being you seem so sure of your response but what the hell..
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my only gripe is with the quick release mount... WTF do you need that for on a bolt gun?
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my only gripe is with the quick release mount... WTF do you need that for on a bolt gun?
Theres lots of reasons you could use quick release rings on a bolt gun:
-Swapping the scope onto the AR for a specific mission
-Taking the scope off for the trek there to protect from damage
-Hiding the profile of the rifle by removing the optic reducing your chance of being pointed out as a sniper.
-Putting your scope on your buddys gun to prove to him its the shooter not the optics.
-Using the scope to make fire
-Last ditch effort when your out of ammo, try to knock out the other guy by throwing the optic
-keeping the optic warm under your jacket in extreme colds to prevent it from freezing up on you
Etc..
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Kenny for the win. [URL=http://www.smileyvault.co
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-Last ditch effort when your out of ammo, try to knock out the other guy by throwing the optic
That's the true warrior spirit [img]http://www.smileydesign.n
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yea i guess i gotta admit defeat on this on. +1 Ken.
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TG, why can't you watch the videos?
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My only gripe is the douche in the video. If he truly trained "thousands of people" then those poor folks are defenseless. Both Savage and Mossberg make accurate, awesome .308 bolt-guns that won't break the bank. Throw some decent, inexpensive glass on, zero it - and Wallah! Just keep up with your mathematics and trigger squeeze for those long-range puffs.
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Both Savage and Mossberg make accurate, awesome .308 bolt-guns that won't break the bank. Throw some decent, inexpensive glass on, zero it - and Wallah! Just keep up with your mathematics and trigger squeeze for those long-range puffs.
I agree with this part of your statement. + I think that those two brands of guns will be more accurate at a reasonable distance than 98% of the people who will be shooting them. Anyone who thinks they will be shooting at a thousand yards and slaying bad guy bodies without constant practice isn't being realistic.
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Both Savage and Mossberg make accurate, awesome .308 bolt-guns that won't break the bank. Throw some decent, inexpensive glass on, zero it - and Wallah! Just keep up with your mathematics and trigger squeeze for those long-range puffs.
I agree with this part of your statement. + I think that those two brands of guns will be more accurate at a reasonable distance than 98% of the people who will be shooting them. Anyone who thinks they will be shooting at a thousand yards and slaying bad guy bodies without constant practice isn't being realistic.
maybe i missed something... the gun in the video is a savage.. also the video was about a sniper rifle not a SHTF primary and employing a sniper rifle means the training required goes without saying to be useful with it. also inexpensive and decent glass cannot be in the same sentance and taken seriously unless you understand that "expensive glass" means 4-5k. and finally mathematics is the least of your worries when shooting long range in a combat environment.
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Where is my popcorn emoticon?
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I spent a little over $100 on a clearance Nikon ProStaff 3-9x40 for my Savage 7mm mag. That's as decent a glass as I plan to get. I don't think I'll ever see a situation where I'll be taking 1000 yard shots. I'll leave that for real sniper people if they feel they are up to it. I just want something I can make a decent shot at 500 to 600 yards. Even at that I suspect those types of shots would be few and far between.
I don't know what situation people are planning for. But if you're taking long shots at an invading army expect the next sound you hear to be a whistling noise followed closely by a loud boom. So shooting one shot and gtfo would be an excellent plan.
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The video above has nothing to do with prepping for SHTF. its a video about what the bare minimum requirements for a reliable long range bolt action. i understand its missleading when posted on a forum such as this. but let me also add it can apply in a very rare instance to prepping but thats not the main purpose of the gun described in the video.
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Ken just had diaarhea of the mouth. "Inexpensive" and "decent" when used with the term "glass" are not mutually exclusive. 2nd: Snipers are this vaunted, worshipped, specialized warrior class. I don't buy into that crap. Long-range rifle shooting is ALL about mathematics and fundamentals. In terms of technical skill and muscle memory the pistol is FAR more difficult to master. The only thing that separates a long-range marksman from a sniper is the stalk and correct camouflage. Why do most peeps fail sniper school? Not their shooting ability. The stalk.
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Well, I don't know about diarrhea of the mouth. Ken pretty much knows his stuff when it comes to long distance rifles and distance shooting. I just think he is thinking at a higher level of precision at greater distances than what most preppers will consider needed. Unless their BOL is like in the Rockies or something. Then they would have to think of angles and altitudes as well. Kind of numbs my mind.
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Could be...I'd like to think with a handgun I'm at a higher-precision at longer ranges than most with more rounds on-target per unit of time. I'll start shooting my bolt-action at 500 instead of 200 and see what I get...
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Could be...I'd like to think with a handgun I'm at a higher-precision at longer ranges than most with more rounds on-target per unit of time. I'll start shooting my bolt-action at 500 instead of 200 and see what I get...
Your absolutely right that shooting a handgun to its maximum potential accuracy is harder PHYSICALLY then shooting a rifle to its maximum potential accuracy if your comparing both guns to the accuracy possible when in a vice. but theres a lot more knowledge behind shooting a precision rifle accuratly consistantly at great distances. if you gave two people sheltered from any gun knowledge each a gun. one a handgun and one a precision rifle and asked them to become as effective as possible with them in there philosophy of use ( pistol 50 yards or less, rifle 1000 yards or less) and gave them unlimited ammo and range time. in one year the guy with the pistol will be a much better example of a good pistol shooter then the guy on the rifle will be as a good example of a good precision rifle shooter. Why? because the pistol is mostly physical difficulty. the pistol shooter has to overcome the fact that hes got only 2 points of contact on the gun VS 4 points of contact on a rifle. The guy on the rifle while he has more points of contact on his rifle making it easier to make an accurate shot when compared to the pistol guy hes also held to a higher standard of whats considered accurate because of that. then throw in the vast knowledge he must aquire in order to shoot at any distance and it becomes a much harder weapon to master. with long range NO ONE masters the wind. some just good pretty good at guessing. pistols have far fewer factors to master. theres a lot more long range shooting then mastering fundamentals unlike a pistol.
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Throws more popcorn in mouth....
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I have to weigh in on this.
Now, keep in mind that I don't buy into a lone sniper prepper/survivalist mentality. But I do know about building a rifle.
As a sside note, look up greybull precision. Ive worked with Adam for a long time. Their success comes from using a quality rifle, with great glass and their custom turret ranging system..
You want to start out with a good solid action. Remington 700's are popular because they are easy to blueprint. Meaning they are easy to turn on a lathe and remove as much out of tolerance material as possible.
You want a stiff receiver, making a savage 110 sub par. Your lugs should be smoked and lapped before a barrel is installed and you want your barrel headspaced correctly before it is installed. No pull through reamers.
you want your barrel lapped and polished correctly.
you want a freefloating barrel with a .30 clearance minimum between the stock and the barrel.
You want length of pull and grip size customized for the shooter
You need to know what round you will be using in the rifle. No mixing and matching.
muzzle crown should be a 11 degree recessed crown
barrel contour should be a minimum of a #4 up to no contour.
scope mounts should never be quick disconnects. A scope needs to stay on the rifle. If you take it off, automatically assume you will have to re-zero the weapon.
triggers should be set to the shooters preference using either a neutral or preferablly positive sear engagement. Never negative. No accutriggers. They move, adjustments are never standardized. One place youshould consider spending money on is a giessele trigger or a timney. They're worth themoney,if only to prevent the headaches.
My personal favorites are Winchester 70's, rem 700s, cz500, a cheaper alternative is a howa 1500. It's a clone of the 700. Older savages are good guns too. Just no spring adjusted triggers.
glass is a preference, just remember thatcheep glass has bad parallax problems and it will cause misses at distances outside of 400 yards. Leupolds are great, nikons are good for the price. You can spend a grip of money on glass.
Barrel manufacturers is a huge consideration. The better the barrel you buy, the better the end product will be.
you want barrel length and twist rate in consideration so you will know the proper barrel length
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Great post doppleganger!
This is the only thing I didn't like.
You want a stiff receiver, making a savage 110 sub par.
But then I'm pretty satisfied with my 110 other than it's too fricking loud with a muzzle brake on it.
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Yeah good post.
But the topic is " Budget Sniper Rifle "
For all that stuff we are not talking about thin budget here.
And from what it sounds your building a rifle that marine corp snipers use. I for one don't have a need for that.
The reason I haven't really jumped in to much on this thread is because EVERYONE here hasn't thought about it to realistically IMO.
For a perfect prepper/budget sniper rifle you should grab an AR15 and throw a bi pod and some glass on it. The follow up shots are a lot more important than sub MOA accuracy. Again IMO a prepper doesn't need a sub MOA rifle that can hit a quarter at 1KM a prepper needs something that takes the same ammo, same mags but has a little bit more range. MAX 600 meters. Anything past that and you should just keep eyes on and wait. No reason to engage something that you are not 100% sure about killing. You'll just give up your position [ not direct position but the knowledge to the bad guy(s) that someone with a rifle is that way ( give direction ) ]
I hope I somewhat made sense.
RvR
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Yeah good post.
But the topic is " Budget Sniper Rifle "
For all that stuff we are not talking about thin budget here.
And from what it sounds your building a rifle that marine corp snipers use. I for one don't have a need for that.
The reason I haven't really jumped in to much on this thread is because EVERYONE here hasn't thought about it to realistically IMO.
For a perfect prepper/budget sniper rifle you should grab an AR15 and throw a bi pod and some glass on it. The follow up shots are a lot more important than sub MOA accuracy. Again IMO a prepper doesn't need a sub MOA rifle that can hit a quarter at 1KM a prepper needs something that takes the same ammo, same mags but has a little bit more range. MAX 600 meters. Anything past that and you should just keep eyes on and wait. No reason to engage something that you are not 100% sure about killing. You'll just give up your position [ not direct position but the knowledge to the bad guy(s) that someone with a rifle is that way ( give direction ) ]
I hope I somewhat made sense.
RvR
YES. +1
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I have to weigh in on this.
Now, keep in mind that I don't buy into a lone sniper prepper/survivalist mentality. But I do know about building a rifle.
As a sside note, look up greybull precision. Ive worked with Adam for a long time. Their success comes from using a quality rifle, with great glass and their custom turret ranging system..
You want to start out with a good solid action. Remington 700's are popular because they are easy to blueprint. Meaning they are easy to turn on a lathe and remove as much out of tolerance material as possible.
You want a stiff receiver, making a savage 110 sub par. Your lugs should be smoked and lapped before a barrel is installed and you want your barrel headspaced correctly before it is installed. No pull through reamers.
you want your barrel lapped and polished correctly.
you want a freefloating barrel with a .30 clearance minimum between the stock and the barrel.
You want length of pull and grip size customized for the shooter
You need to know what round you will be using in the rifle. No mixing and matching.
muzzle crown should be a 11 degree recessed crown
barrel contour should be a minimum of a #4 up to no contour.
scope mounts should never be quick disconnects. A scope needs to stay on the rifle. If you take it off, automatically assume you will have to re-zero the weapon.
triggers should be set to the shooters preference using either a neutral or preferablly positive sear engagement. Never negative. No accutriggers. They move, adjustments are never standardized. One place youshould consider spending money on is a giessele trigger or a timney. They're worth themoney,if only to prevent the headaches.
My personal favorites are Winchester 70's, rem 700s, cz500, a cheaper alternative is a howa 1500. It's a clone of the 700. Older savages are good guns too. Just no spring adjusted triggers.
glass is a preference, just remember thatcheep glass has bad parallax problems and it will cause misses at distances outside of 400 yards. Leupolds are great, nikons are good for the price. You can spend a grip of money on glass.
Barrel manufacturers is a huge consideration. The better the barrel you buy, the better the end product will be.
you want barrel length and twist rate in consideration so you will know the proper barrel length
yeah thats the way to IDEALY do it... not the least acceptable....
And that greybull Turret system is a gimmick... any serious precision shooter wouldnt be caught dead with that silly thing on their scope. only way that turrets going to be reliable is if your hunting indoors where conditions are always the same. Everyone likes to cash in on ignorant hunters looking for a hunter proof (dummy proof) way to shoot far without knowing shit but in reality theres no replacement for knowing wtf your actually doing. Mil or MOA is the only way to go for shooting at extreme long distance... period.
Also i dont think i agree with you that quick release rings will all lose zero from being removed and then reinstalled. i have no experience with quick release rings hands on but i know many much more experienced guys then myself use them with no issues. let me add that even my non quick release Seekins rings can be removed from the base and reattached and still hold a zero. thats why they cost what they do, the tolerances are very tight.
Also parallax can be an issue even on the top dollar scopes if your not exactly repeating the same cheek weld and the parallax is out of adjustment.
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Agreed. My mosin 91/30 (even with custom gunsmithing and accurizing) is less than most "budget" sniper rifles. My glass is 3 x 9 power with 40 relief. I'm thinking of going to 4 x 16 glass to get me out a little farther. It's usually a 1moa rifle with the ammo I shoot (match grade 182 fmj) on mediocre range days. On good days it can actually do sub MOA. [URL=http://www.smileyvault.co
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As the addendum said at the beginning of my post mentioned, I don't buy into "sniper rifles". Just never have. I've always felt that opsec and being invisible are the most important aspects of staying alive. My family has chosen the ar platform, mostly because of our environment and expected usage. I did visit a friend out i40 east and could definately see the need for a thousand yard gun out there.
The rifle I described isn't a military grade sniper rifle. It is described as a gunsmith putting together a sub moa bench rifle for competition using basic techniques and building over the course of a few months a couple of hundred dollars at a time.
I think a great "budget sniper rifle" would be a druganov ... Ak platform/family, accurized-ish. Good round. Semi auto, with a Provence track record. Used to be you could find them for about 700, haven't looked for one in years though. Heard they're hard to find now.
Honestly speaking, the earliest "sniper" rifles were deer guns with glass. And our average 30-06 bolty is more powerful and more common than sniper rifles in
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Honestly speaking, the earliest "sniper" rifles were deer guns with glass.
Yeah, that's me. I'm a deer and hog sniper. Although, I'm pretty bad ass at throwing rocks at annoying crows as well. :)
You irritating, winged, black, taunting, evil thieves tremble in fear. The rock chunker commeth.