When Do Your Close The Hatch To The Ark?

[JohnyMac]

My paranoid antenna right now is vibrating more and more as each day passes. My big concern is; it has been made very obvious that the left will not allow Trump to take up residence at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

I hear things like taking the man out, canceling elections, martial law, WW III, black flag events, etcetera etcetera etcetera. With President Biden (Pushed by Jill and the other Elites who do not want to loose power) digging his heels in about not running for President, with other prominent Democrat's who were calling for him not running reversing course, leads me to think, somethings up. There is a plan to screw up the election on November 5th.

With that written, when do you shut the hatch (companion way) to the ark? Fill the moat? If your plan is to bug-out to the redoubt when? Pull the plug? Form that neighborhood/MAG group for security patrols? Block off your road and set up the LP/OP? Etcetera.

One of the things I use to do when I was VP for West Marine, I would war game possibilities with my District Managers. The only thing that ever caught us off guard was 9/11, however, we adapted quickly merging several war games scenarios together and exit with a well working hybrid.

Have you put together scenarios yet? Have you even thought about it? Have you practiced the scenarios?

Years ago my original MAG put together a five level Defcom list outlining scenarios and actions to take. I will try to find it and post here, however, it ranged from Defcom 5 where we were monitoring events with little action needed to Defcom 3 where we made plans to bug out to the redoubt, to Defcom 2 where we all bugged out to the redoubt, to Defom 1 where the LP/OP was manned and patrols began.

Do you have something like that for your family or MAG? If you do, this is the place to share them. Why reinvent the wheel.

 

[Felix]

Preps are both specialized and general, in order to flex with circumstances.
Coiling the spring tight, stretching the rubber bands... all without specific aiming point when the command to "loose" comes down.
Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the face.
No battle plan survives contact with the enemy.
You go to war with the army you have, not the army you might want or wish to have at a later time.
Stay frosty.
Keep your head on a swivel.

Best I see myself doing is to use each day to refine skills, add to stores, learn about my surroundings and those who live in them.
As for a MAG... I really do suspect that when the reality comes, they will ALL be subject to radical rework, rethink, modified application.   People are funny, ya know?   Stress brings out the _real_ character of a person.  Take nothing for granted.  But depend on the Lord and your own good cheer.  Just as panic can be contagious, so can shows of courage and optimism - whatever the situation or odds.

[Sir John Honeybucket]

Useful question, because normalcy bias generally blunts or entirely prevents immediate actions , even in the face of attacks.  I do believe that the first few days to weeks will be very easy pickings for criminal elements if we suffer a complete loss of the rule of law. Our advantages is living out in the country; dead end road on a dead end 'highway' ( peak traffic is maybe 5 cars per minute when the fish plant lets out.). We have Baltimore and Washington DC only a half a tank of gas away from us and the likelihood of enough local violent looting and misc. crime that I anticipate early in our nearest town as soon as the EBT cards stop working if not before and these incidents, as happens now, will be unreported for political reasons. 

Frankly, we are a small group of houses in a very defensible location, once organized.  Unorganized, we are easy pickings.  I'd love to meet local Civil War reenactors to be ready to bring their cannons and to send grape shot down our only approach route as needed, but the neighborhood committee might consider that to be extreme ( sarc ).

In tne meantime, we grow our garden in peace and piddle with radios.

73 de Sir John Honeybucket

[Felix]

Closing the door to an ark implies limits.     Like those stenciled on lifeboats - "Capacity - 24".

Playing Noah, deciding what your boat is capable of sustaining without a fatal overload... _that_ will be the mother of all nightmares.   Both in deciding and keeping to the decision.

I believe that MAGS will naturally form and or dissolve around this simple fact.
Then, it's all ad hoc, "going to war" with the "army" you find yourself with.

[Sir John Honeybucket]

These are two sides of the same coin:

Capacity or required inclusion ?

I come from the idea of minimal inclusion.  That is; perhaps we have an absolute baseline survival carrying capacity of 8 people, but I ONLY feel compelled to include four: all family members.  To me, each additional mouth to feed above my wife and myself also comes with the potential for disease, theft, internal conflict and unless there is a particular and practical advantage they bring, I slam the door shut at the minimum amount we must take in. This is not a core of trained, disciplined soldiers, with important skills, experience and equipment who will simply endure the difficulties and fight like lions when needed, maintaining team integrity.  No, these are unskilled, unproven mouths and disease vectors off the street and frankly, they can remain there. Unless they are a very compatible medical doctor or other useful skillset, I am not interested. For me my duty is to preserve such family as is within arms reach.  Probably assist a neighbor here and there, particularly the aged who have worked for a living their entire lives.  As for the  'wretched refuse' wandering in from their cities, they would be wise to never be seen in large groups within 500 meters of our home.

Sir John Honeybucket

[DMCakhunter]

JM,
You are certainly right that the clock is getting closer to go time.
Is a good time to review food supplies and any items that we might want to swap out for newer or improved versions.
We are going to add a standby generator and propane tank. Easier for my wife to manage if I am not there to hook up a generator and back feed into the house.
Have noticed that my bank is asking more questions when I take cash out, which is odd. They lowered the limit that requires a signature to $4000 this year. While I don't like it, it is the only way I can get $100 bills. I just say I am going to vegas.
Will also refresh our stored gas cans this weekend. We do it in the summer to have summer blended fuel.

On the ark - the door is always open for immediate family, which is small. Happy to help good neighbors for a period of time.
Our secondary location is better for bad times. Has a well, wood stove and is on a lake. Fewer people and away from cities. Just have to get there.

[JohnyMac]

DM wrote, "Our secondary location is better for bad times. Has a well, wood stove and is on a lake. Fewer people and away from cities. Just have to get there."

Yes sir, that is the crux of the challenge if SHTF or worse TEOTWAWKI arrives. How do you get there? Especially with all your stuff? 

Well I am sure DM, you and the rest of your tribe have a plan. 

This is a good time to stop reading UP, and go find your old novel "Patriots" by Rawles. The first 100 pages is all about that, e.g. the migration to ones "bug out" location.

This is where the Decom 5 - 1 Rules of Engagement come in. At the time we decided to bug out to the redoubt when we lived in Rhode Island to Pennsylvania, at Defcom 3. The 320 mile journey would be a major challenge at Defcom 2 or near impossible at Defcom 1. Just food for thought.

 

[Sir John Honeybucket]

Yeah, I used to live a few hours from our redoubt: had to get around Washington DC to reach it.  The ring road is bad on a good day, post apoc it might have been better to just remain in my little rental and drink heavily, which would be about as productive as being stranded with 1.7 million of my closest acquaintances on the 495 and/or 695. Did I develop and alternative plan and route? Yes, but it was long and easily disrupted. Then I switched to living aboard the sailboat, my Bug-Out-Boat, well stocked.  That gave me a fighting chance, once I reached the boat. 



I was curious how many miles off shore I needed to be to stop seeing the pillars of smoke from the DC/Baltimore area.

Now, we live in a very rural, farming, fishing and woodland region, in a small cottage with deeded access to the salt water.   The woodstove is fed from wood here on the lot, septic and well are game changers for those who have ever gone without for any length of time. WE can, pressure can and occasionally dry our surplus harvest and anything else we see at a good price, including meat. I'm old, half blind and without a good reference point, I'd walk in circles, due to my bad leg, but life is good and fairly independent. Oh and, my local radio noise on HF is usually S when there are no thunderstorms...



Now

[Jackalope]

    I've been reading this thread with interest, and noted many great comments.  For us, we'll close the gate when a major event occurs.  For instance, when the Chinese virus initially kicked off, we closed the gate and didn't leave the homestead for nearly a month, and monitored the situation.  What's a major event?  Anything that is a major disruption for society, i.e., financial collapse, war (nuclear or civil), internet collapse, grid collapse, etc.

    As a few forum members know, we purchased a parcel of land elsewhere on the Cumberland Plateau.  It's just land, but it has given us the opportunity to design and build a homestead/redoubt from scratch.  I'll discuss our progress on the project in a separate posting.  We feel like there's an urgency to get as much done prior to the elections, as possible.  Carrying capacity was a major factor in purchasing a larger parcel of land than where we currently live.  Remoteness is a factor too, as the new property is on a gravel road that typically sees maybe 20 cars per day, if that much.  We're at that awkward stage, where not all of our preps are at the new site, yet it is definitely a more survivable location for the long term.   If the SHTF tomorrow, we would convoy to the new parcel and settle in.  True survival is a mindset, not stuff.  It's nice to have food for a year, but the knowledge of how to produce food, in the most austere conditions, is more important.

     Get those area studies done, and network with your neighbors.

[JohnyMac]

jackalope, I am looking forward to reading about your new redoubt.

I too have been thinking of buying another parcel of land and starting from scratch. Certainly, more remote than what we have now although, we are pretty remote. If I broached the subject with MrsMac, I fear she will kill me.

Dreaming is good as it allows one to expand their knowledge.

Truthfully though, we are where we are, probably better then most, and we just need to focus our energies to the now. Jackalope, I agree that as we approach the November election, things will deteriorate. If Trump makes it to the November election and wins by overcoming the fraud that we will see; the period between November 6th and the beginning of spring will be frosty. Probably the drama we will see will be something this country has not seen since the American Civil War of the 1860's.

  so far I have been wrong on all of my predictions so do not take my comments to the bank.   

[pkveazey]

I've read all the comments on this thread and liked them. It made me think more about things like, What have I done? What am I doing? What have I planned to do when the SHTF? The one thing that comes to mind first is whatever I do in the future when the SHTF will have to be fluid. There could be a future time when it's hunker down and fight and there could be a time when its grab that Go Bag and run like Hell. I guess it'll be, I'll know what to do when I know what to do. In the meantime, out here in the country where people are more pragmatic as opposed to city folks who are more idealistic, I'll just weigh my options and do what the majority of my MAG members do. The Lone Wolf thing of living alone in the forest does not appeal to me but I guess I could do it as a last resort. As for those people who live in the CITY...... We're going to miss you around here.

[DMCakhunter]

JM,
Location is 370 miles away. Ford excursion has a 700 mile range on a full tank. Will allow back road travel if we need to avoid big cities

[JohnyMac]

Cool bens DM. 

Kinda like my f-150 at the time which had ~650 mile tank.

[Stephen]

This is a topic that we've talked about in our local prep group - but only briefly. We have all agreed that we aren't going anywhere. This is where we make it or break it, and we prepare accordingly. We're in a fairly rural area (the smallest property size any of us lives on is one acre), but certainly not "middle of nowhere" rural. Our unincorporated area is a well-defined 5 miles long by 2 miles wide that is bordered on one side by a lake / wildlife refuge (i.e., a swamp).

Up until about two years ago, I owned a 120 acre farm that was a 2-hour drive from here, and I could have moved there at any time or used it as a bug out location - but I didn't. Taking a long hard look at the situation, it just doesn't make any sense for any of us to go anywhere. Instead, we focus on where we are now.

Another big factor - I've got six grandchildren ranging in age from 13 down to 5 - all living less than 8 miles from here, and they are number one priority. I've lived here for over 25 years, have family and friends and church and political connections that are invaluable. Having a good local reputation is priceless, and in a time when trust means everything, leaving this area would mean leaving behind that most precious advantage.

Back years ago, when I was seriously looking at the bug-out possibility, I quickly realized that there was no way that I could travel  and carry anywhere near enough stuff with me. It just wasn't going to happen. I realize that lots of folks live in or close to the urban death traps, and bugging out is the only realistic option. I'm just grateful to not be in that situation. Best wishes to all who have to deal with that. I'm blessed. Be well, friends.

[grizz]

my hatch is closed but it could open under the right circumstances